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Post by ganews on Dec 2, 2022 12:57:08 GMT -5
moimoi has been voted Secret Santa, and her present to all of us is Barbra Streisand, "Live at the Bon Soir", recorded in 1962 and released in 2022. Will it be a cookie or a lump of coal?
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Post by Desert Dweller on Dec 3, 2022 13:09:20 GMT -5
Well. Barbara Streisand is a great singer. So, I don't expect it to be a lump of coal. I'll try to give it a listen this week. My mom is a huge fan of Streisand's. I wonder if I should get her this album. Hmmm.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Dec 3, 2022 21:33:04 GMT -5
Ah, I looked this up... Very interesting that this was supposed to be her debut album, but they shelved the live recordings in favor of studio recordings the following year. It's been a long time since I listened to those studio versions. Perhaps I will do that, too.
The wikipedia entry for this album contains this note: the Bon Soir tracks were remastered under the supervision of Streisand and Jochem van der Saag. "The club's acoustics were obviously not designed for recording, and there was a lot of leakage from the instruments into [Streisand's] vocal mic"
Ha! We were just talking about this problem with a concert I was doing recently - leakage of instruments into the singers' mics. Sometimes I am very happy to not be a sound technician.
I'll do a few of these now.
1. "Much More" - this is a nice song from the musical "The Fantasicks". Despite the audio editing/mixing challenges the article was talking about, I think they did a great job here. There is a wonderful clarity in this mix. Her singing sounds so much more clear and free than it does in the studio recording. I can actually hear a bit of strain in her voice in the studio version, so this was wonderful to hear. I also like the instrumentation more in the live version. I like the more active piano. I also think her emotional performance is better live, there is a bit more nuance to the lyrics.
2. "Napolean" - Ha! She is acting the hell out of this.
3. "I Hate Music" - Ah, some good old Bernstein. She gets what he wanted out of this. Good for her for not playing it coy.
4. "Right as the Rain" - Fine.
5. "Cry Me a River" - Wow, truly excellent job with the mastering. Wow, this live version is better than the studio version. She's a bit too actor-y, just a touch too overwrought in the studio version. This live version is much more natural and free. I love to hear her longer phrases. Again I like the instrumentation better live. Much prefer the jazz piano to the heavy strings in the studio recording.
6. "Value" - Wow, it is fun to hear her working the crowd in these. Crazy, she has to be around 20 years old at this time. Ah, this was a fun one.
Okay, stopping there for tonight. Some good stuff here. Great mixing/mastering job. Her voice sounds amazing. Her performance quality really comes across. I am quite enjoying hearing her at this young age. I like the more raw, unpolished performances she is giving.
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Post by ganews on Dec 6, 2022 17:07:10 GMT -5
I run hot or cold on musicals, but I have very little interest in showtunes. It would have to be a great song that can really stand alone and have some exciting instrumentation behind it, which seems to me really isn't the point of a musical that is telling a larger story. Nor do I have a lot of interest in sparsely-backed crooning. I'm not exactly the target audience here.
Anyway, the lady can sing and put in a lot of personality. But I'm certain I'd rather see Streisand performing in a musical (and I have seen some of her movies) than spend the equivalent time listening to her sing unrelated songs. My favorite tracks were "Napoleon", "Lover, Come Back to Me", and "A Taste of Honey".
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Post by Desert Dweller on Dec 7, 2022 0:50:25 GMT -5
7. "Lover, Come Back to Me" - OMG, this is so great. GREAT!
8. Soon It's Gonna Rain" - I'm so happy to have these live club versions. Because I kinda hate the 60s production on her first studio album with many of these songs. Her singing is roughly the same on these two versions, but I much prefer the simpler club instrumentation/arrangement. This isn't my favorite song in her set, though. It is a bit too overwrought.
9. "Come to the Supermarket in Old Peking" - Like, this club arrangement is FAR FAR better than what is on the studio album. Her diction is also better live. They must have told her to relax it when she was on mic in the studio. Don't care for this song, though.
10. "When the Sun Comes Out" - It's okay.
11. "Happy Days Are Here Again" - I know this is one of her standards, but I just don't like her version.
12. "Keepin' Out of Mischief" - It's fine.
13. "A Sleepin' Bee" - Her acting performance in this is really good, but I don't like the song.
14. "I Had Myself a True Love" - I really like this one.
15. "Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered" - Meh
16. "Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Wolf" - LOL, "they say I don't sing standards. So here's a standard". Atta girl.
17. "I'll Tell the Man in the Street" - Meh
18. "A Taste of Honey" - I really like her interpretation of this.
19. "Never Will I Marry" - I really like her arrangement of this one. Good job. Great singing in this.
20. "Nobody's Heart Belongs To me" - Eh, it's fine. I'm not a fan of these Rodgers/Hart interpretations she's doing.
21. "My Honey's Lovin' Arms" - This is a much better performance from her than what existed on the original studio album. It's pretty good.
22. "I Stayed Too Long at the Fair" - This is very good. Love her acting performance through this.
Overall, very good! Great job with the mastering, especially considering the audio challenges. Love hearing these club arrangements. This really shows off Streisand's dramatic chops as a singer. Her theatricality is great in this. Beautiful singing throughout.
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Post by pantsgoblin on Dec 7, 2022 12:18:42 GMT -5
I couldn't get even to 15 seconds of her singing. I'm sorry, moimoi, I like and respect you, but this an area where my hackles come up.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Dec 8, 2022 0:50:30 GMT -5
I run hot or cold on musicals, but I have very little interest in showtunes. It would have to be a great song that can really stand alone and have some exciting instrumentation behind it, which seems to me really isn't the point of a musical that is telling a larger story. Nor do I have a lot of interest in sparsely-backed crooning. I'm not exactly the target audience here.
Anyway, the lady can sing and put in a lot of personality. But I'm certain I'd rather see Streisand performing in a musical (and I have seen some of her movies) than spend the equivalent time listening to her sing unrelated songs. My favorite tracks were "Napoleon", "Lover, Come Back to Me", and "A Taste of Honey".
I don't really like hearing showtunes sung in concert form, except under very specific circumstances. Like, I don't mind hearing a collection of singers do a retrospective on a specific Broadway composer/team. I've got a few compilation albums of various Broadway singers doing Rogers & Hammerstein songs, or Sondheim collections, etc. But I usually prefer these to be a variety of singers, not just one person. The only person I'll voluntarily listen to sing showtunes is Bernadette Peters. She has a live Sondheim collection that is out of this world good. (With a full orchestra, not just a jazz combo.) I'd say my total number of these kinds of Broadway albums in my collection is less than 10.
But I'm not typically a fan of what Streisand doing here, just throwing together a hodge podge list of showtunes from a large variety of composers. I wouldn't voluntarily listen to this.
And yes, I, too, would much rather just watch Streisand in "Funny Girl", or some other show. I didn't really like her song choices on this. I think I only heard 5 or 6 that I liked. Those Rodgers/Hart songs are just incredibly dull. And there were several that she even seemed somewhat bored by.
That said, her singing on this is very good. I love hearing her at this young age. Her technique is so great. I love to hear the variety of vocal tools she is using to produce the dramatic effects she wants. I really love her acting and performance quality.
So, I did enjoy her singing, even if I didn't really like *what* she was singing.
Edited to add: I should say that what I do have are quite a lot of collections of Classical singers performing classical songs. This is very different than showtunes for me. For instance, Dietrich Fischer-Dieskau singing Schubert's Winterreise is a classical masterwork. I think I have 8 different recordings of Schubert's Winterreise alone.
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repulsionist
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Post by repulsionist on Dec 8, 2022 16:34:08 GMT -5
Nice one, moimoi. I like Babs as a personality, ca. 1980s and beyond. I like some of Funny Girl. I got to "I Hate Music" before saying I'd be visiting this later - which I probably, but don't count me out yet, won't. Like Desert Dweller, I truly appreciate Streisand's voice and her abilities. What she's singing isn't my cuppa. At all.
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moimoi
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Post by moimoi on Dec 10, 2022 16:15:55 GMT -5
OK, so I might have used this second Secret Santa win to abuse my power. It was really hard selecting an album last time, so I tried not to wring my hands as much and just go with my gut: what album from this past year have I been enjoying and what do I think people should hear if they haven't already. Also, my admiration for Streisand is already on record in the April Fools' nomination of Guilty, so I figured this was a rare opportunity to celebrate one of the best to ever do it. 1. Intro / My Name is Barbra/ Much More - A dynamic opener that I imagine quieted any chatter in the room. It's just crazy to think this was among her earliest performances because arguably she never sounded better (and she routinely sounds amazing). 2. "Napolean" - Starts with a fakeout--that's confidence. Her delivery reminds me of Sara Vaughan. Who knew there would be a subtle critique of capitalism as well? 3. "I Hate Music" - Playful and edgy at the same time. An interesting transition to the more straightforward, sentimental... 4. "Right as the Rain" - And I have chills. 5. "Cry Me a River" - I think this is the most riveting from an acting perspective. The whole reason I listened to this album was after hearing this embedded in a Guardian interview with her where she talked about her lack of formal training as a singer, but her considerable training as an actor. When she says that she approaches songs as an actress rather than as a singer, you really hear it here and understand why that sets her apart. The world is full of technically perfect singers with stale or stiff delivery. My ultimate example is Doris Day , who sings with the detached arrogance of someone who knows she's 'delivering' without any connection to what she's singing. 6. "Value" - Peaks and valleys - the woman knows how to pace a set. After taking us to the depths of heartache, she comes back with wry humor. 7. "Lover, Come Back to Me" - Oo, original interpretation! I think this gets a little heavy-handed, but it's also short, so moving on, we have some fun band intros that take us into... 8. "Soon It's Gonna Rain" - Another slow builder. Didn't do much for me. 9. "Come to the Supermarket in Old Peking" - Very Cole Porter. I think the idea was to show off her ability to do one of these technically difficult, wordy songs, but this one sounds better as an instrumental. It's a bit of a waste of her ability. 10. "When the Sun Comes Out" - An easy walkabout to help her catch her breath. I agree with Dweller - it's fine. 11. "Happy Days Are Here Again" - We've all heard this one I'm sure. It's interesting to hear her voice give out a bit at the end of this live recording - obviously they corrected that on the studio version. But this was probably a good place for an intermission. 12. "Keepin' Out of Mischief" - This has the insouciance of "Sadie, Sadie" from Funny Girl, which makes me wonder if this Fats Waller composition might have been its inspiration. 13. "A Sleepin' Bee" - An illustration of why Truman Capote didn't have more hits as a songwriter. Kind of meandering and dull, though Streisand does her best to sell it. 14. "I Had Myself a True Love" - I think this suffers from placement after another slow, introspective ballad. I would have maybe put this as the lead-up to "Happy Days..." or after a faster version of "Bewitched, Bothered..." 15. "Bewitched, Bothered, and Bewildered" - Yeah, she needed to pick up the pace here. This song has a lightness to it that is kind of lost. Not my favorite interpretation. 16. "Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Wolf" - This is her "standard" - ha! She's having fun here and it should have come after "Keepin' Out of Mischief". And if you think this is annoying, I dare you to listen to her interpretation of another standard " Jingle Bells" which - despite my affection for her - is the worst version of a Christmas carol I've ever heard. 17. "I'll Tell the Man in the Street" - Strong performance of a kind of pedestrian song. Fine. 18. "A Taste of Honey" - Nice change of pace to something more modern (for the time) sounding. 19. "Never Will I Marry" - Her Italian is impressive! And again, I like the turn toward more modern compositions, even if this one ends somewhat abruptly. 20. "Nobody's Heart Belongs To me" - I feel like for the last three tracks she should be building up to something and that's not what's happening here. She needed an '11 O'Clock" showstopper here. 21. "My Honey's Lovin' Arms" - I prefer this to "Never Will I Marry" as it's another one the vein of Funny Girl that plays to her strengths. One of my favorites from this album. 22. "I Stayed Too Long at the Fair" - Solid, but I feel like she could have closed with something more dramatic. Like, these days I imagine she'd close with "Happy Days" or "My Man" or "People" (still kills) or " On a Clear Day You Can See Forever" (I hope). Still, if this is what she closed with, I'm happy with it.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Dec 10, 2022 18:54:26 GMT -5
16. "Who's Afraid of the Big Bad Wolf" - This is her "standard" - ha! She's having fun here and it should have come after "Keepin' Out of Mischief". And if you think this is annoying, I dare you to listen to her interpretation of another standard " Jingle Bells" which - despite my affection for her - is the worst version of a Christmas carol I've ever heard.
OMG, I was just talking about her terrible Jingle Bells version with someone in my choir last week. One of the soloists in our concert this year attempted to do the Streisand version. The woman next to me listened to this and goes "Why does this song exist?" Indeed.
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Post by 🔪 silly buns on Dec 12, 2022 11:05:38 GMT -5
Thank you for getting me out of my comfort zone of music I listen to. I have heard Barbara sing, but not actually sat down to listen to her.
I like her voice and I love her sense of humor throughout the songs, but this isn't quite my cup of tea. But I get why she's a star.
Since I like Bab's humor, is there a movie suggestion?
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moimoi
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Post by moimoi on Dec 12, 2022 18:00:27 GMT -5
Thank you forgetting me out of my comfort zone of music I listen to. I have heard Barbara sing, but not actually sat down to listen to her. I like her voice and I love her sense of humor throughout the songs, but this isn't quite my cup of tea. But I get why she's a star. Since I like Bab's humor, is there a movie suggestion? Funny Girl changed my life. There is no better story of a 'quirky, unconventional' woman triumphing through sheer grit and undeniable talent. I still marvel at "I'm the Greatest Star". I don't remember the sequel, Funny Lady, as well, but I think it was ok. I'm also partial to Hello Dolly despite its cheesier, campier moments (reminds me of The Music Man) and I love the fashion in On a Clear Day You Can See Forever, though the plot isn't great. I think Jack Nicholson does an early bit part in it... What's Up Doc is super wacky, so not for everyone, but personally, I'll take that over something as sappy as The Way We Were.
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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Dec 13, 2022 9:20:57 GMT -5
Thank you forgetting me out of my comfort zone of music I listen to. I have heard Barbara sing, but not actually sat down to listen to her. I like her voice and I love her sense of humor throughout the songs, but this isn't quite my cup of tea. But I get why she's a star. Since I like Bab's humor, is there a movie suggestion? Funny Girl changed my life. There is no better story of a 'quirky, unconventional' woman triumphing through sheer grit and undeniable talent. I still marvel at "I'm the Greatest Star". I don't remember the sequel, Funny Lady, as well, but I think it was ok. I'm also partial to Hello Dolly despite its cheesier, campier moments (reminds me of The Music Man) and I love the fashion in On a Clear Day You Can See Forever, though the plot isn't great. I think Jack Nicholson does an early bit part in it... What's Up Doc is super wacky, so not for everyone, but personally, I'll take that over something as sappy as The Way We Were. What is your opinion of Original Old Timey A Star Is Born?
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Post by Powerthirteen on Dec 13, 2022 12:40:03 GMT -5
Thank you forgetting me out of my comfort zone of music I listen to. I have heard Barbara sing, but not actually sat down to listen to her. I like her voice and I love her sense of humor throughout the songs, but this isn't quite my cup of tea. But I get why she's a star. Since I like Bab's humor, is there a movie suggestion? What's Up, Doc? is one of the five or ten most wall-to-wall funny movies I've ever seen.
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moimoi
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Post by moimoi on Dec 13, 2022 15:34:26 GMT -5
Funny Girl changed my life. There is no better story of a 'quirky, unconventional' woman triumphing through sheer grit and undeniable talent. I still marvel at "I'm the Greatest Star". I don't remember the sequel, Funny Lady, as well, but I think it was ok. I'm also partial to Hello Dolly despite its cheesier, campier moments (reminds me of The Music Man) and I love the fashion in On a Clear Day You Can See Forever, though the plot isn't great. I think Jack Nicholson does an early bit part in it... What's Up Doc is super wacky, so not for everyone, but personally, I'll take that over something as sappy as The Way We Were. What is your opinion of Original Old Timey A Star Is Born? I have seen the first two films. I think the first one with Fredric March as Norman Maine is fine--kind of an average melodrama. The second with James Mason and Judy Garland has better performances and cinematography. I have no interest in Barbra/Kris Kristofferson or Gaga versions.
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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Dec 13, 2022 16:23:29 GMT -5
What is your opinion of Original Old Timey A Star Is Born? I have seen the first two films. I think the first one with Fredric March as Norman Maine is fine--kind of an average melodrama. The second with James Mason and Judy Garland has better performances and cinematography. I have no interest in Barbra/Kris Kristofferson or Gaga versions. Lol, I actually thought the Streisand/Kristofferson version was the original, my bad. For what it’s worth, I think the Gaga/Cooper film is perfectly watchable, if unspectacular.
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Post by King Charles’s Butterfly on Dec 27, 2022 13:37:52 GMT -5
Reminded to reply to this by a Key & Peele sketch where Peele telling his camp office mate to listen to some “normal gay music, like Barbara Streisand,” part of the punchline beeing that Peele was using “gay” in a positive way.
I went in having very little relationship with Streisand’s music. She was very much not what my parents were interested in. I was in a couple of musical productions in high school, one of which was Hello Dolly. Our drama teacher loathed the Streisand Hello Dolly and everything was modeled after the Carol Channing version. She was perfect for the role and a great singer too but…that’s going to be stuck in my head until my brain stops working. After fiftten years of that I welcome Streisand (non-Dolly material).
She really was miscast in the role, too. As much as I think of Streisand as a “for people older than my parents” she sounds really young at the beginning, young and cute. It’s very disarming (“Big Bad Wolf” is a great breather too). The live club sound also helps a lot too—these sort of songs really do benefit from being seen live, especially if they’re removed from their plays. It stops sounding like a portfolio and more purposeful. That said I do think this erred a bit on the side of collection—I personally didn’t get that much sense of progression or pace, which made some of the songs blend together.
I’m sure my own lack of knowledge of this era of showtunes definitely hurt me here too. I mostly know isolated songs from earlier—like stuff you hear in a Fred Astaire movie and are surprised it had some earlier musical context—on or post-1960 stuff.
Speaking of that it’s a shame the idea of “Great American Songbook” has kind of been lost. It was probably an inevitable thing given changes in media consumption/cultural reach/just who could get music published and played, but it probably needed faster-than-glacial additions to its 20s-40s core. This stuff is hard, though—I’ve also been on the pit side of musical theater and this is legitimately sophisticated music. Making it seem intimate and immediate is no small thing.
I first listened to this before Christmas and it was a good match in terms of how I was feeling. Thank you for the introduction.
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repulsionist
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Post by repulsionist on Feb 7, 2023 16:57:54 GMT -5
Babs gotta memoir comin' out in late 2023. It will be fabulous!
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