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Post by Jean-Luc Lemur on Mar 14, 2017 23:27:39 GMT -5
There have been notable exceptions, but on the whole the staff, O'Neal in particular, has made no bones about the fact that they loathe the commentariat, even back in the "Golden Age" post-registration, pre-Disqus era. Well, maybe things have changed in the last four years, but he did once write this: Sean ONeal Staff Lurky McLurk. • 4 years ago Ah, that makes more sense. Thanks. Glad we have better commenters here than The Hollywood Reporter, South West News Service, Gawker, UPROXX, etc. This is the first place I've seen this story where someone's stepped in to clarify that. (Which I mainly remember because of the massive ego stroke). I don’t think I’ve noticed O’Neal much in the comments since his return (I’ve also dropped off of reading newswire due in large part to business, and when I do read I often skip the comments anyway—often felt a bit too bitter and with the same few people), but pre-Starwipe he didn’t strike me so much as surly so much as no-bullshit (hell, he had Rich Texan as an avatar, guns smoking). But the rare times I’ve actually interacted with him in the comments it was on non-newswire stuff (it’s a shame he doesn’t—or isn’t able to—do more music writing), and he was quite nice. Anyway, over at The Solute I think Miller’s got the right read on all of this:
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Post by swagonion on Mar 14, 2017 23:53:44 GMT -5
I honestly wonder if this is going to be the beginning of the end of the AV Club as a relevant website. The amount of decline it's had in just the last six months is kind of shocking. According to Quantcast (which is not always a great indicator), they've had some of their best days ever since December 2016. It looks like a lot of them closely coincide with major political events, which explains the shift to covering Trump so extensively. And those days are certainly bigger than any while I was there. In general, the AVC's traffic has been going up over the past five years, not down. I love comments sections, and I love reader engagement, but as I think about starting a web site of my own, the more I wonder if they aren't more hassle than they're worth in 2017. Thanks to the presence of the alt-right, in particular, but other, less well-known brigading groups, every single comment section is a ticking time bomb, especially if you don't want to invest in community moderators. (Thus, it makes a lot of sense that this change applies just to Newswire, the place where alt-right crazies are most likely to pop in.) The answer to that even five years ago was, "Geez. Invest in a community manager," or "Have your social media person keep an eye on comments," if you were, somehow, a site with a social media manager in 2012 (most sites wouldn't have had one at that time). But in 2017, people who read these articles on computers -- and are thus the most likely to comment -- are rapidly becoming a smaller percentage of your total readership, at least in comparison to people who randomly click on things on their phones. So your money is best invested in getting as many people to click on your article on their phone, not in fostering a comments section. This is sort of why comments sections are probably on the way out at all but a few sites.
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 15, 2017 5:21:02 GMT -5
I honestly wonder if this is going to be the beginning of the end of the AV Club as a relevant website. The amount of decline it's had in just the last six months is kind of shocking. According to Quantcast (which is not always a great indicator), they've had some of their best days ever since December 2016. It looks like a lot of them closely coincide with major political events, which explains the shift to covering Trump so extensively. And those days are certainly bigger than any while I was there. In general, the AVC's traffic has been going up over the past five years, not down. I love comments sections, and I love reader engagement, but as I think about starting a web site of my own, the more I wonder if they aren't more hassle than they're worth in 2017. Thanks to the presence of the alt-right, in particular, but other, less well-known brigading groups, every single comment section is a ticking time bomb, especially if you don't want to invest in community moderators. (Thus, it makes a lot of sense that this change applies just to Newswire, the place where alt-right crazies are most likely to pop in.) The answer to that even five years ago was, "Geez. Invest in a community manager," or "Have your social media person keep an eye on comments," if you were, somehow, a site with a social media manager in 2012 (most sites wouldn't have had one at that time). But in 2017, people who read these articles on computers -- and are thus the most likely to comment -- are rapidly becoming a smaller percentage of your total readership, at least in comparison to people who randomly click on things on their phones. So your money is best invested in getting as many people to click on your article on their phone, not in fostering a comments section. This is sort of why comments sections are probably on the way out at all but a few sites. But that only really reinforces my thoughts on it - it's gotten more clickbaity and off-mission, and its ratings have gone up. It seems plausible to me that in another six months the TV reviews are gone, the good features are even rarer, and, from a business standpoint, it's doing fine. I didn't mean relevant from a business standpoint. I meant relevant from a "worth reading" standpoint.
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Mar 15, 2017 6:58:17 GMT -5
I honestly wonder if this is going to be the beginning of the end of the AV Club as a relevant website. The amount of decline it's had in just the last six months is kind of shocking. According to Quantcast (which is not always a great indicator), they've had some of their best days ever since December 2016. It looks like a lot of them closely coincide with major political events, which explains the shift to covering Trump so extensively. And those days are certainly bigger than any while I was there. In general, the AVC's traffic has been going up over the past five years, not down. I love comments sections, and I love reader engagement, but as I think about starting a web site of my own, the more I wonder if they aren't more hassle than they're worth in 2017. Thanks to the presence of the alt-right, in particular, but other, less well-known brigading groups, every single comment section is a ticking time bomb, especially if you don't want to invest in community moderators. (Thus, it makes a lot of sense that this change applies just to Newswire, the place where alt-right crazies are most likely to pop in.) The answer to that even five years ago was, "Geez. Invest in a community manager," or "Have your social media person keep an eye on comments," if you were, somehow, a site with a social media manager in 2012 (most sites wouldn't have had one at that time). But in 2017, people who read these articles on computers -- and are thus the most likely to comment -- are rapidly becoming a smaller percentage of your total readership, at least in comparison to people who randomly click on things on their phones. So your money is best invested in getting as many people to click on your article on their phone, not in fostering a comments section. This is sort of why comments sections are probably on the way out at all but a few sites. I think you're right, but now I'm just depressed. ( The A.V. Club)
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Dellarigg
AV Clubber
This is a public service announcement - with guitars
Posts: 7,632
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Post by Dellarigg on Mar 15, 2017 7:32:05 GMT -5
Mr Greene seems to be back, anyway.
EDIT: I'm not saying this is a blunder.
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Post by Meth Lab Shenanigans on Mar 15, 2017 8:34:25 GMT -5
I mentioned this over at the Old Country, but I just truly don't think they want us anymore. I'll probably be more active at the AVC After Dark in the future. All the stuff I joined the original AVC for is gone.
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Post-Lupin
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Immanentizing the Eschaton
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Post by Post-Lupin on Mar 15, 2017 9:01:03 GMT -5
If they impose the new system on Reasonable Discussions, I'm done with TOC.
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Post by Powerthirteen on Mar 15, 2017 10:29:17 GMT -5
I honestly wonder if this is going to be the beginning of the end of the AV Club as a relevant website. The amount of decline it's had in just the last six months is kind of shocking. This is sort of why comments sections are probably on the way out at all but a few sites.
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Post by Dr. Rumak on Mar 15, 2017 11:58:54 GMT -5
OK, as someone mentioned, if you append ?permalink=true to an article URL, it opens up with the old format with avatars and notifications and everything. Who Cares I Just Watch TV wrote a Tampermonkey script that does this automatically, and it works for me (although I had to restart my browser after restarting it). It's available here. I have not tested with Greasemonkey on Firefox, but usually scripts that work in one work in the other. I now have 2 Tampermonkey scripts installed, and they are both to help me comment at AVC. (The other one automatically expands all the comments so I don't have to click on "Load More Comments").
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 15, 2017 15:09:56 GMT -5
The comments are an absolute wasteland today.
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Post by The Larch on Mar 15, 2017 18:25:44 GMT -5
I just clicked on a GJI (don't judge me) and found that the article was repeatedly embedded in itself. Quite terrifying. Don't know if it's my browser being screwy though.
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 15, 2017 19:01:37 GMT -5
The only advantage I can see to the AVC running articles on celebrity photo theft scandals is that I get to add a ton of people to my block list.
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Mar 15, 2017 21:02:48 GMT -5
The comments are an absolute wasteland today. Even non-Newswire comment sections are dead. Reasonable Discussions felt like a ghost town.
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 15, 2017 21:04:56 GMT -5
The comments are an absolute wasteland today. Even non-Newswire comment sections are dead. Reasonable Discussions felt like a ghost town. Some of the GJIs have had an insane number of comments, though. But I think this may be the beginning of the end for the community over there.
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ayatollahcm
TI Pariah
The Bringer of Peacatollah
Posts: 1,689
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Post by ayatollahcm on Mar 16, 2017 1:22:07 GMT -5
Who the fuck knows.
Still, an hour into Thursday's content and the comments are fucking dead as shit.
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Post by Pastafarian on Mar 16, 2017 8:09:27 GMT -5
It’s funny going back to the first page of this thread and much of it’s about music reviews and Salman Rushdie. I’d gladly take those blunders now. And Castro is for real dead now! Oh how naive I was!
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 16, 2017 8:16:26 GMT -5
It’s funny going back to the first page of this thread and much of it’s about music reviews and Salman Rushdie. I’d gladly take those blunders now. And Castro is for real dead now! Oh how naive I was! It's telling how much of a news blackout I was in in November that I apparently missed Castro dying.
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Post by pairesta on Mar 16, 2017 9:54:44 GMT -5
OK so now apparently they've turned off AVClub account access for Newswires. I'm not logged into Newswire comments at all. When I go to log in, it only gives options for Disqus and Facebook, no AVClub accounts. I'm logged in and can comment on non Newswire features, but not Newswire articles. And I still can't see icons on newswires.
Edit: I know people have been plugging this but I tried the "?permalink=true" trick of adding it at the end of the URL and it worked! I can see avs again! I'm logged in! Oh, sweet old comment section that still sucks but not as bad as it does now, I missed you!
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Post by Powerthirteen on Mar 16, 2017 10:33:48 GMT -5
OK so now apparently they've turned off AVClub account access for Newswires. I'm not logged into Newswire comments at all. When I go to log in, it only gives options for Disqus and Facebook, no AVClub accounts. I'm logged in and can comment on non Newswire features, but not Newswire articles. And I still can't see icons on newswires. Edit: I know people have been plugging this but I tried the "?permalink=true" trick of adding it at the end of the URL and it worked! I can see avs again! I'm logged in! Oh, sweet old comment section that still sucks but not as bad as it does now, I missed you!
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Post by Pedantic Editor Type on Mar 16, 2017 11:28:37 GMT -5
They fixed the newswire comments.
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Post by Powerthirteen on Mar 16, 2017 11:35:31 GMT -5
They fixed the newswire comments. Sort of.
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Post by Pedantic Editor Type on Mar 16, 2017 12:08:21 GMT -5
They fixed the newswire comments. Sort of. It seems like a good compromise to me, as long as it works properly. I haven't had any issues so far.
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 16, 2017 12:28:11 GMT -5
It's mostly fixed. I can live with it. It doesn't totally fuck up the site like the old version.
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Dellarigg
AV Clubber
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Posts: 7,632
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Post by Dellarigg on Mar 16, 2017 12:31:20 GMT -5
Do we love Sean again now?
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Post by pairesta on Mar 16, 2017 12:58:03 GMT -5
They fixed the newswire comments. And used a surprisingly contrite Newswire to announce it, even!
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LazBro
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Post by LazBro on Mar 16, 2017 13:12:50 GMT -5
Back when I read Joblo.com regularly, I always liked how whenever they rolled out a new look for the site (which was at least every 2 years), they would do a post which had screenshots of every previous iteration of the site back to the beginning. It was always a fun little nostalgia trip of "oh man, remember when the site looked like that?!"
It'd be fun to see something like that for TOC. Of course, I could probably cobble something together myself using the Wayback Machine, but that sounds like work, and I'm not even about that.
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Ben Grimm
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Post by Ben Grimm on Mar 16, 2017 13:33:23 GMT -5
Back when I read Joblo.com regularly, I always liked how whenever they rolled out a new look for the site (which was at least every 2 years), they would do a post which had screenshots of every previous iteration of the site back to the beginning. It was always a fun little nostalgia trip of "oh man, remember when the site looked like that?!" It'd be fun to see something like that for TOC. Of course, I could probably cobble something together myself using the Wayback Machine, but that sounds like work, and I'm not even about that. web.archive.org/web/20070810073132/http://www.avclub.com/content/
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Mar 16, 2017 19:08:19 GMT -5
It seems like a good compromise to me, as long as it works properly. I haven't had any issues so far. Yeah, I'm fine with it. I have no real objections to the forever scroll of Newswires: I just want comments to work, and they do!
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Post by Logoboros on Mar 17, 2017 0:39:20 GMT -5
This newswire: Donald Trump’s “Irish proverb” was written by a Nigerian poet
Uncorrected as of 12:30 a.m. CDT. In the gleeful rush to announce another instance of Trump foolishness -- in this case reading a poem which someone on Twitter claimed was by a Nigerian poet -- Barsanti throws this article up. Except, as several commenters have started noting on that article, the attribution to the Nigerian poet is based on the poem appearing on poemhunter.com (the only place where this poet's name appears), and a quick Google Books search shows this poem appearing in countless inspirational books and toastmaster handbooks and glurge of all kinds, including a submission of the poem to 1936 union worker's journal. So you get the extra irony of the entire article being premised on Trump's sloppy research skills and being itself an example of precisely the kind of sloppy research it's accusing him of. I have not been in the chorus of commenters demanding that the AVC stop with the Trump articles (I think the articles are generally pretty substanceless, but I enjoy having the community space to vent in -- or even just vicariously vent by watching other like-minded people vent), but if they're going to slide into knee-jerk, thoughtless partisanship (which we might as well just call propaganda and be done with it), then maybe they'd be better off dropping political coverage if they're going to be so cavalier about it. It is rather hard to believe that this is the same publication that was so scandalized by Leonard Pierce violating reviewer ethics given the breadth of non-journalism being conducted there now.
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Post by rimjobflashmob on Mar 17, 2017 4:29:12 GMT -5
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