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Post by haysoos on Apr 13, 2021 9:28:25 GMT -5
I really thought Walker and Hoskins had already taken the serum. I guess this gets around only having one vial.
(ETA that I was too tired to add last night: but did they really have to fridge the black guy? Come on. Sure, having two vials mysteriously unbroken is more of a stretch, but come on.)
"The Patch project" -- they really are trolling the comics readers, aren't they? Sharon is totally The Power Broker.
I remember when people would wait a while for spoilers -- I got what Ayo did to Bucky's arm spoiled yesterday in plain sight, and the episode only came out two days ago. The mobile interface for this site sucks, but nearly all mobile interfaces suck, and I am too tired to get off the couch right now. The inevitable and nearly instantaneous spoilers are the primary reason why I've taken to the high seas for the Mandalorian and continued to hoist the Jolly Roger for Wandavision and Falcon & Winter Soldier. The reveal at the end of the last episode of Season 2 of the Mandalorian was spoiled on multiple YouTube thumbnails within HOURS of the episode airing. If I had not watched it that morning before work instead of waiting until the evening like usual, it would have been ruined for me.
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Post by Ben Grimm on Apr 17, 2021 6:41:59 GMT -5
I thought the last episode was the best so far, just a great blend of action, character work, and social commentary. And Carl Lumbly really knocked it out of the park with the material he was given.
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on Apr 17, 2021 22:11:21 GMT -5
It just warms my heart that they broke Walker's arm* to get the shield off.
Look not to be a total straight girl but I would like to thank God and also Jesus for
Never in a million fucking years would I have predicted the MCU would do a scene like the one between Isaiah Bradley and Sam Wilson. That was amazing.
Last week I told my friend, "Being Captain America is like being a politician. Anyone who wants to do it should by no means be allowed to do it," and that's why Sam Wilson is the perfect choice thank you for coming to my TedTalk.
*ok sure it could have been sprained but "broken" makes me feel better look I'm a vengeful bitch ok & I hate that fuckin guy
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Crash Test Dumbass
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Post by Crash Test Dumbass on Apr 18, 2021 12:41:53 GMT -5
I was trying to remember who Contessa Val was in the comics and there was an article asking if she was the Power Broker. No, Sharon is totally the Power Broker. Val was a high-up in Hydra. I remember the streak in her hair. Sarah and the kids are gonna die, after all that talk about respecting the Black experience, and they're still going to fridge the Black family, and I am preemptively SO PISSED even though they haven't done it yet and might not even do it. It's totally Ving Rhames' soul in the box from Wakanda.
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Post by The Stuffingtacular She-Hulk on Apr 18, 2021 15:15:05 GMT -5
Val also has a romantic history with Nick Fury, which I now desperately wish to see. She is currently Madame Hydra, I believe, or at least was at one point in the comics, but I think they're actually making her Leviathan here. (See: Dottie Underwood, AKA beloved Soviet proto-Black Widow who should have gotten to kiss Peggy Carter again. For reasons.) Which would make more sense timeline-wise.
As to your second point, I cannot think that Disney would be that tone-deaf and stupid, especially considering that they were still filming this show last year. Put them in danger? Sure. But I really can't see an MCU property not on Netflix going so dark.
It's a Captain America suit for Sam, probably with some sweet-ass new wings.
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Post by Ben Grimm on Apr 23, 2021 8:14:24 GMT -5
I liked the last episode. It gave us a nice sense of closure on the Isaiah and Flag Smasher storylines, Bucky finally finished his book, Sam got a spanky new uniform, John became USAgent, everybody in Louisiana had a nice party and nothing bad happened to them (serious, CTD, I genuinely don't know what you were thinking there). Also, (Rosa Diaz voice) I've only had Curtis Harding for an hour and a half, but if anything happened to him, I would kill everyone in this room and then myself.
I kind of wanted to see Torres become Falcon, but that's probably for the next season. Sam's big debut as Cap was the main reveal for this episode, and that was right and proper.
Sharon is definitely a Skrull. She'll be the Spider-Woman/Veranke reveal during Secret Invasion, but they'll have another Jessica Drew there (I'm guessing that's who Emilia Clarke is playing) to throw us off.
It's really handy for Zemo to have all those supervillains in the same building with him there. It'll make it much easier for him to put together the Masters of Evil that way.
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on Apr 23, 2021 22:43:23 GMT -5
Ok I was expecting Bucky talking to his old man friend to make me cry, but it was the statue of Isaiah & his response that did it. That was...oof. Totally did not see it coming and it hit hard. Y’all speechifying must be a side effect of carrying the shield cause DAMN, Sam out-did any of Steve’s. I see Bucky learned some of his motorcycle-riding skills from Steve “motorcycles are for throwing” Rogers. Man, Karli’s version of the serum must be shit if she can’t even take a couple of bullets. On the plus side, that means Walker can’t take a couple of bullets either. OMG that Army guy called him SERGEANT BARNES! And Bucky straight-up non-ironically called Sam “Cap” HOW am I supposed to live a complete and fulfilling life without new episodes every week?! WE DON’T EVEN HAVE A SEASON TWO GUARANTEE YET.
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on Apr 23, 2021 22:58:25 GMT -5
I liked the last episode. It gave us a nice sense of closure on the Isaiah and Flag Smasher storylines, Bucky finally finished his book, Sam got a spanky new uniform, John became USAgent, everybody in Louisiana had a nice party and nothing bad happened to them (serious, CTD, I genuinely don't know what you were thinking there). Also, (Rosa Diaz voice) I've only had Curtis Harding for an hour and a half, but if anything happened to him, I would kill everyone in this room and then myself. I kind of wanted to see Torres become Falcon, but that's probably for the next season. Sam's big debut as Cap was the main reveal for this episode, and that was right and proper. Sharon is definitely a Skrull. She'll be the Spider-Woman/Veranke reveal during Secret Invasion, but they'll have another Jessica Drew there (I'm guessing that's who Emilia Clarke is playing) to throw us off. It's really handy for Zemo to have all those supervillains in the same building with him there. It'll make it much easier for him to put together the Masters of Evil that way. THANK YOU for doing the legwork re: that end credits song.
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Post by Ben Grimm on Apr 24, 2021 7:19:57 GMT -5
I liked the last episode. It gave us a nice sense of closure on the Isaiah and Flag Smasher storylines, Bucky finally finished his book, Sam got a spanky new uniform, John became USAgent, everybody in Louisiana had a nice party and nothing bad happened to them (serious, CTD, I genuinely don't know what you were thinking there). Also, (Rosa Diaz voice) I've only had Curtis Harding for an hour and a half, but if anything happened to him, I would kill everyone in this room and then myself. I kind of wanted to see Torres become Falcon, but that's probably for the next season. Sam's big debut as Cap was the main reveal for this episode, and that was right and proper. Sharon is definitely a Skrull. She'll be the Spider-Woman/Veranke reveal during Secret Invasion, but they'll have another Jessica Drew there (I'm guessing that's who Emilia Clarke is playing) to throw us off. It's really handy for Zemo to have all those supervillains in the same building with him there. It'll make it much easier for him to put together the Masters of Evil that way. THANK YOU for doing the legwork re: that end credits song. We've already bought both his albums.
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Post by ganews on Apr 24, 2021 9:00:12 GMT -5
It was a pretty good show.
It wasn't just the last episode - last week was also full of heartfelt monologues delivered between characters. I liked it anyway.
Another final fight in the dark?? That was disappointing. The desert helicopter scene at the beginning was so well-done, why couldn't we have the similar final fight staged in a setting that is easier to see?
It took me a beat to figure that was Zemo's one-line elderly butler heading off an important plot point for the future. Julia Louis-Dreyfus is always a delight.
The Flag Smashers had the worst secret signal ever. It was literally the same "ca-caw ca-caw!" that the Kiwi mutant kid from Deadpool 2 cast aside as stupid a couple years ago.
The Power Broker was definitely the weakest part of the show.
Don't Sam's ears get cold?
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Post by Crash Test Dumbass on Apr 24, 2021 10:14:28 GMT -5
I'm very glad to have been wrong. Karli had threatened Sam's family in an earlier episode and they were all happy last time and I was really worried, OK? I feel like the USAgent stuff was kind of shoehorned in. Also, how did Walker still have the costume after his trial? I know he made the shield himself, I saw that bit. He was handling his scenes surprisingly calmly for all the rage in the last two. Everyone commenting that Sharon is a Skrull is making me wary and unhappy. I've been unhappy since the Skrulls showed up in Captain Marvel and the reveal in Spiderman: Homecoming just further annoyed me. The Skrulls are such an easy copout and Secret Invasion was bad and everyone involved should feel bad. I teared up a little during Sam's speech and Bucky talking to Yori. Why was this only six episodes?
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Post by ganews on Apr 24, 2021 19:28:40 GMT -5
I like the MCU a lot, but the AVC review of the last episode had even me thinking "take it down a notch".
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Post by Crash Test Dumbass on Apr 25, 2021 12:15:46 GMT -5
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on Apr 25, 2021 17:06:19 GMT -5
I’m boggled by anyone who thinks the show shouldn’t have been stumbling “under the weight of Captain America’s legacy” . Of course it is. I mean what the actual fuck, you absolutely, positively HAVE to address how Steve disappearing and someone else taking over the legendary title/position would affect everyone, especially people who were his actual personal friends. Especially the newer boyfriend guy he tapped to take his place, and the guy who was his best boyfriend friend for actual decades. I mean personally thought they would gloss over that, because it’s not smash-punch-fight enough, and it’s not like any kind of introspection is a hallmark of the MCU. I was happily surprised by how deeply they did manage to introspect, and that it wasn’t half-assed, like, say, reactions to Natasha’s death. “Stumbling Under The Weight Of Captain America’s Legacy” is practically the subtitle of the show ffs.
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Post by The Stuffingtacular She-Hulk on Apr 26, 2021 10:44:07 GMT -5
My final verdict on the show is that its politics were a mess, Marvel Studios did not really fully think through how they were going to handle the after-effects of The Snap in-universe, and it was very obviously a product of pandemic interruptions, but that the character development was A+. And honestly, I watched this show solely because Bucky and Sam are two of my favorite characters in both the MCU and the comics, and I was absolutely dying for them to finally get their due on screen. I love the personalities the writers have chosen to give both of them - which are, in fact, pretty close to their 616-universe selves. I wonder how much input Sebastian Stan and Anthony Mackie had into that, or if they just decided to play it like their comic-book counterparts.
I cracked up out of sheer delight at the reveal of Sharon as the Power Broker. This heel-turn into selling U.S. intelligence secrets is so much more interesting than her SHIELD/CIA agent career. I think she might be a Skrull, but if she isn't, that's even more fun.
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Post by haysoos on Apr 26, 2021 11:50:35 GMT -5
So how come after an entire season of character work and putting all the baggage of his past life and identity that wasn't him behind him, in the end credits Sam gets a name change but Bucky is still stuck with "Winter Soldier"?
Calling someone who targets civilians and non-military installations with violent action for the purpose of creating terror to effect political change a "terrorist" seems like a pretty textbook definition for the term.
The most accurate and meaningful metaphor in the series: in order to get a functional suit that isn't riddled with spyware, Captain America has to out-source his suit, jet-pack, wings, and drone technology to another country.
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Post by Superb Owl 🦉 on Apr 26, 2021 12:15:00 GMT -5
I think my feelings are pretty similar to The Stuffingtacular She-Hulk . This was a good-but-not-great mini-series that ultimately was always going to end up with muddled politics and storytelling because when it comes down to it making a statement is always going to take a backseat to protecting Disney's golden goose and setting up further installments. I'll stop short of saying that MCU shouldn't even bother trying to tackle bigger things, but you just have to go in prepared for them to not stick the landing. haysoos reminded me of another tangentially related thought I had the other day: they are really going to struggle to integrate Fantastic Four and specifically Reed Richards should they ever get to that seemingly inevitable point. They've done a good job capitalizing on Black Panther's popularity to have Wakanda fill in that Tony Stark (and to a lesser extent SHIELD) role of being the source of all the random superhero technology that shows up. It's going to be hard to have another white guy super-genius showing up (that has historically also served that purpose) not seem a bit regressive.
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Post by Ben Grimm on Apr 26, 2021 12:42:49 GMT -5
haysoos reminded me of another tangentially related thought I had the other day: they are really going to struggle to integrate Fantastic Four and specifically Reed Richards should they ever get to that seemingly inevitable point. They've done a good job capitalizing on Black Panther's popularity to have Wakanda fill in that Tony Stark (and to a lesser extent SHIELD) role of being the source of all the random superhero technology that shows up. It's going to be hard to have another white guy super-genius showing up (that has historically also served that purpose) not seem a bit regressive. One of the many, many benefits of casting LaKeith Stanfield as Reed Richards. He's been my pick for a while.
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Post by Superb Owl 🦉 on Apr 28, 2021 9:26:41 GMT -5
I thought this piece had some interesting thoughts on where Falcon & Winter Soldier missed the mark. You can say what you want about pre-MCU superhero movies playing fast-and-loose with the characters or not 'staying true' to the comic book roots, but I think the writer does touch on the shortcomings of the 'slavishly give the comic book fans what they want' approach. Did it really make sense for this version of Sam to take on the Captain America mantle if you remove the all the meta-context?
‘The Falcon and the Winter Soldier’ Never Took Its Protagonist Seriously
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Post by Ben Grimm on Apr 28, 2021 11:22:58 GMT -5
Did it really make sense for this version of Sam to take on the Captain America mantle if you remove the all the meta-context?
Yes, mainly because Walker's situation had made it clear that someone was going to take it, and if it wasn't someone that Sam approved of, whoever they were was inevitably going to sully Steve's legacy. The whole series is about Sam and Bucky reckoning with Steve's legacy and deciding how to best go about honoring it. Sam's initial response - which I still think would have been his preference, all things considered - was to let Steve's legacy me a museum exhibit; no one was going to match up to him. But after the Walker disaster, the best Sam could hope for is that the government would do a better job screening the next Captain America, and in the end, still come up with someone who wouldn't measure up. So Sam thought the only thing he could do to try to do it himself.
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Post by Superb Owl 🦉 on Apr 28, 2021 11:47:07 GMT -5
Did it really make sense for this version of Sam to take on the Captain America mantle if you remove the all the meta-context?
Yes, mainly because Walker's situation had made it clear that someone was going to take it, and if it wasn't someone that Sam approved of, whoever they were was inevitably going to sully Steve's legacy. The whole series is about Sam and Bucky reckoning with Steve's legacy and deciding how to best go about honoring it. Sam's initial response - which I still think would have been his preference, all things considered - was to let Steve's legacy me a museum exhibit; no one was going to match up to him. But after the Walker disaster, the best Sam could hope for is that the government would do a better job screening the next Captain America, and in the end, still come up with someone who wouldn't measure up. So Sam thought the only thing he could do to try to do it himself. That's fair, but I think it also shows how just cherry-picking the "best" concepts and stories from the comics sometimes ends up feeling a bit unsatisfying. I have not yet read that actual run, but in the comics world Sam taking up the shield comes after at least two different failed replacements for Steve (that I can think of, honestly there are probably more), Sam already having storyline history with being unwitting token representation, Bucky having his turn to carry the legacy, etc.. It plays differently. Coming to the conclusion that he basically has to do it despite the obvious reasons not to feels more earned. It's not really the MCU series fault that it instead feels really obviously reverse-engineered to get Sam in the suit because The Fans will be excited about the idea of seeing Sam in the suit (Just Like The Comics!!). Yea, John Walker is there to justify the decision, but it's obvious that's why he got worked into this show, if that makes sense. It doesn't feel like anybody thought "wouldn't it be interesting if somebody who really shouldn't be in that position took over for Steve?" and then they extrapolated out how Sam, Bucky, etc. would all respond to that. He just got pulled out of their closet of Marvel IP as the most useful way to get from Point A to their desired Point B. The valuable IP strings were a little to visible (imo).
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Post by Prole Hole on Apr 29, 2021 15:37:22 GMT -5
The biggest problem with Falcon And The Winter Soldier is that it's really difficult to milk drama from a foregone conclusion. Will Sam become Cap? Gasp with the opposite of shock as he does! The storytelling was wobbly, the show was sold as a buddy-cop thing then contrived to have Sam and Bucky spend as much time apart after Ep1 as was humanly possibly while technically being on the same show, Sharon Carter isn't terribly compelling, nothing about Sokovia is remotely compelling (a big MCU problem when trying to hang so much off it) and New Captain America had to be a douche if Sam was going to (inevitably) step up. It turns out that New Captain America (inevitably) is a douche and so Sam (inevitably) has to do something about that and (inevitably) ends up taking the shield (inevitably). Bits of it were sporadically entertaining but "sporadically entertaining" is the best it ever got. I can't really speak to the impact of the whole racism and class thing (what with being profoundly white and middle class) but it felt clumsy in a way that I don't think it had to. Maybe others with more direct experience can speak to that but I don't think it packed the punch it was meant to. In the end if we had, at the end of Endgame, had Sam go "sure, Steve, I'll carry your legacy forward" and just skipped all this noise nothing would really be different. So what's the point?
TL;DR - When's Loki on?
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Post by Superb Owl 🦉 on Apr 29, 2021 16:25:58 GMT -5
The biggest problem with Falcon And The Winter Soldier is that it's really difficult to milk drama from a foregone conclusion. Will Sam become Cap? Gasp with the opposite of shock as he does! The storytelling was wobbly, the show was sold as a buddy-cop thing then contrived to have Sam and Bucky spend as much time apart after Ep1 as was humanly possibly while technically being on the same show, Sharon Carter isn't terribly compelling, nothing about Sokovia is remotely compelling (a big MCU problem when trying to hang so much off it) and New Captain America had to be a douche if Sam was going to (inevitably) step up. It turns out that New Captain America (inevitably) is a douche and so Sam (inevitably) has to do something about that and (inevitably) ends up taking the shield (inevitably). Bits of it were sporadically entertaining but "sporadically entertaining" is the best it ever got. I can't really speak to the impact of the whole racism and class thing (what with being profoundly white and middle class) but it felt clumsy in a way that I don't think it had to. Maybe others with more direct experience can speak to that but I don't think it packed the punch it was meant to. In the end if we had, at the end of Endgame, had Sam go "sure, Steve, I'll carry your legacy forward" and just skipped all this noise nothing would really be different. So what's the point? TL;DR - When's Loki on? I think it's useful to compare this to WandaVision, which I'm sure also had some specific Point B's to move characters toward, but they were ones that much less obvious to the audience going in. Other than knowing that Wanda probably wasn't going to die because they'd already announced she'd be in Doctor Strange 2, it at least felt like there was a pretty wide range of possible conclusions. F&WS had exactly one and as I said above, it made the entire story feel very calculated. Also, Emily VanCamp still has some residual REVEEEEEEEENGE season 1 goodwill with me, but you are absolutely right that Sharon (at least her MCU iteration) is boring as hell and leaving out the 'mystery' of the Power Broker would have, at the very least, cleaned up the proceedings.
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Post by Ben Grimm on May 1, 2021 10:56:14 GMT -5
Assuming that future series are ok here, the first pic of Iman Vellani as Ms. Marvel has come out (probably an illicit set pic):
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on May 1, 2021 21:56:23 GMT -5
The biggest problem with Falcon And The Winter Soldier is that it's really difficult to milk drama from a foregone conclusion. Will Sam become Cap? Gasp with the opposite of shock as he does! The storytelling was wobbly, the show was sold as a buddy-cop thing then contrived to have Sam and Bucky spend as much time apart after Ep1 as was humanly possibly while technically being on the same show, Sharon Carter isn't terribly compelling, nothing about Sokovia is remotely compelling (a big MCU problem when trying to hang so much off it) and New Captain America had to be a douche if Sam was going to (inevitably) step up. It turns out that New Captain America (inevitably) is a douche and so Sam (inevitably) has to do something about that and (inevitably) ends up taking the shield (inevitably). Bits of it were sporadically entertaining but "sporadically entertaining" is the best it ever got. I can't really speak to the impact of the whole racism and class thing (what with being profoundly white and middle class) but it felt clumsy in a way that I don't think it had to. Maybe others with more direct experience can speak to that but I don't think it packed the punch it was meant to. In the end if we had, at the end of Endgame, had Sam go "sure, Steve, I'll carry your legacy forward" and just skipped all this noise nothing would really be different. So what's the point? TL;DR - When's Loki on? Sure, Captain SamMerica was always going to happen, but media about historical events -military, cultural, or biographical- by definition “milk drama from a forgone conclusion”, as do movies based on books, but I rarely hear anyone complaining “oh there should be no more movies about WWII because we all know the Allies won so what would be the point digging into the perspectives and experiences of individuals?”* I mean if people examining their place within events isn’t your jam, ok, but brushing off character development as “noise” is pretty reductive. Given the MCU’s history of spending almost zero time caring about the development of characters not named Tony Stark, this show’s allowing Sam and Bucky to breathe & live outside of the borders of a summer blockbuster was completely unexpected & a really nice change from always focusing on WORLD THREATENING EVENTS. That’s not really relatable for most people, but “Am I good enough to take up this job?” Or “Can I be a better person?” are extremely relatable situations. It sounds a little pat, but the show was about the journey & not the destination. I’m definitely not saying it was perfect, but dismissing it as pointless because we know Sam was going to take up the shield seems like a little ridiculous. As an aside, I’m also profoundly white & middle class, and I thought the musings on race and identity packed quite the punch (which is also the reaction I’ve seen across ye olde internets). The parts on class tried, but stumbled, which may be due to America thinking we don’t have a class problem, or that the people in charge of production are definitely part of that problem. *for other reasons, sure, but not for that one
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Post by WKRP Jimmy Drop on Jun 9, 2021 20:06:56 GMT -5
I mean obviously it’s just the first episode, but I have to say that I have little to no interest in Loki becoming a Stronger, Gentler God of Mischief Through Half-Assed Psychotherapy. I like tricksters as tricksters, not as poor misunderstood woobies who are just acting out. I continue to blame Branagh for the whole ~~Loki is so traaaagic~~ approach.
I am very much into “stupid bets made by bored Asgardians”, though, gimme more of that please!
Also idk if anyone else has read The Chronicles of St. Mary’s, but the Time Variance Authority is so far portrayed exactly how The Time Police are.
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Post by The Stuffingtacular She-Hulk on Jun 11, 2021 10:07:46 GMT -5
Much to my surprise, Loki's first episode was the one I enjoyed most out of the three Disney+ series. I say I am surprised mostly because I have never in my entire MCU-watching life given a single crap about Loki. The TVA set design is like if Jack Kirby produced The Price Is Right and I love it.
Also, good to see Pillboi found some purpose in the afterlife.
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Post by haysoos on Jun 11, 2021 10:29:49 GMT -5
From the trailers, I initially thought that Loki was going to be in some kind of Good Place/Defending Your Life/RIPD afterlife, and would need to find **bleech** redemption or something before he could move forward.
I like the TVA idea a little bit better, but I'm still getting a bit too much afterlife/redemption vibes - which is a waste of Loki.
They could be using this to firmly establish the MCU as the only canonical timeline, and the lack of any reference to Coulson being alive after his encounter with Loki, and the appearance of Peggy Carter could be indications that they're retconning the TV series, and especially the Netflix Marvel series out of existence, or they could be setting us up for Loki breaking the whole TVA and setting the Multiverses free (and thus the plots of the upcoming Doctor Strange and Spider-Man movies).
I'm trying not to hold out hope for the latter, when it would make things legally simpler for Marvel to do the former, and they categorically refused to take their own opening to do something similar with the X-Men universe in Wandavision. But there's a glimmer of hope there.
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Post by liebkartoffel on Jun 11, 2021 11:06:33 GMT -5
Much to my surprise, Loki's first episode was the one I enjoyed most out of the three Disney+ series. I say I am surprised mostly because I have never in my entire MCU-watching life given a single crap about Loki. The TVA set design is like if Jack Kirby produced The Price Is Right and I love it. Also, good to see Pillboi found some purpose in the afterlife. Loved the 70s sci-fi book cover look of...wherever the TVA is supposed to be when they panned out to it. I thought the pilot was great, but it was also one of those pilots that doesn't really give you any idea of what the series proper is going to be like.
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Post by ganews on Jun 13, 2021 16:35:41 GMT -5
It's a good start, but I found everything about the production so far to be very reminiscent of FX's Legion. The lighting, the costuming, the retro design, the effects that are accomplished with digital film editing. That's not really a bad thing, though so far this does not have as good a supporting cast. Seeing as how I never did watch the final season of Legion, it's probably good that Loki is a limited run.
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