Game of Thrones: experts speculation [SPOILERS!]

Aw, I can definitely see that happening. A friend and I were just discussing this the other day, actually. Neither of us could figure out how they could get Shae to wind up sleeping with Tywin. Obviously, we both love Charles Dance too much in this role, because this idea never occurred to either of us. We even talked about how we love him so much that it will now be kind of sad to see Tywin die.

So yeah, I find this idea highly plausible.

I dunno, I guess I disagree with the premise that the show Shae is so remarkably different than the book Shae that she'd never turn on Tyrion. I can definitely see her as being opportunistic enough to throw in her lot with Tywin, especially if Tyrion does something to drive her away, and for her and Tywin's fate to play out as they did in the book.

Also, in case anyone missed it, the new trailer:


Braavos!

How old is the Titan supposed to be? Because the Colossus of Rhodes didn't last that long and it was nothing but a pair of disembodied feet after a couple of centuries.

It looks pretty cool, but I think the book description is a bit more realistic as far as how big it is and that the legs are basically just carved granite ridges that were already there.
link

this one looks closer to Eiffel Tower height (1,000 ft) rather than the Colossus of Rhodes (100 ft) or Statue of Liberty (150 ft). Given the size of the ship under it, there may be some perspective lost with the city and bridges in the background, but we don't really know the size of the ship. If it is a like a Spanish Galleon, the mast could be over 100 ft, making the statue around 500 or 600 ft at the helmet. As it is there is no way that could stand under its own weight, much less a light breeze.


Looks like they did away with the green hemp hair, perhaps they will keep the fires in the eyes, the horn sounding and especially the murder holes under the skirt.

It still made me sit up and say the same thing as @outrageousfrenchguy but my next thought was why doesn't it fall over? It would be like trying to get a green plastic army man to stand up on shag carpet.

4 new making of featurettes:










Confirmation of the battle of the wall in Ep 9 and I think I saw Stannis in there too. Looks like purple wedding in Ep 2 or 3.

The Hound was awesome in that last scene. I now like him more than I did in the books. Going to be a shame to lose him as part of the tv series.

Good question. I honestly have no idea what the show writers are doing with Stannis. He feels so different than the book version. At this point, I'd think the tv series would need to test Stannis this way even more than the books did. The show seems too close to making him seem like a religious fanatic.

Right, they seemed to start to combine Gendry with Edric Storm's story from the books when the Brotherhood sold him to Melisandra:


I don't think we have seen him again right?

Yeah, Davos sent Gendry out onto the sea in a boat in the third season finale, to save him from Melisandre.

I haven't watched an episode this season(was waiting to marathon), but this development pretty much makes me want to give up on the show. The scene in the books felt like a huge moment for Jaime and Cersei. I read it as him learning that maybe he doesn't want to be with Cersei, that he can tell there is something off about her after all he had been through since they were last together. Cersei has been the toxic part of Jaime's life really. He has been doing everything out of love for her, his motivations for all his other things actually make sense and make him seem like he isn't that terrible of a guy. He is just painted as evil to the realm because he betrayed the king(justifiably), and painted as evil to the readers/watchers at first because he pushed Bran out the window(when really he was just trying to protect the people he loved). That is what I have loved about the Jaime character, that he is really put in these situations and while he does do seemingly the wrong things, they are at least not totally for the wrong reasons. It is what makes his character complex and one of the most developed in the entire series. To have him rape Cersei though? That is just..... uggh. 

As for Cersei, it also felt like she was realizing that Jaime is not the man she wants to really be with. That it isn't what she really wants anymore either. That is not to mention that having her get raped is just so fucking stupid. It is a development that is not needed for her character, and it is a piss poor trope to fucking use. Cersei is very well written, and to have to resort to this for her character? Fuck that.

Now, it has been said by the director he was just trying to portray it like it was in the books(based on the reactions from pretty much everyone who has read it.... wrong). I guess they won't intend to follow up on this as it was a rape, so at least there is that. But it will still be hard to view either character in the same light after the fact, because it does change the whole context for the two characters.

And doesn't GRRM know about all the show changes as they're written? I can just imagine him chortling to himself, "ho ho, this will get those readers in a twist!"
I'd like to think they have some great plan, that this change is somehow necessary to the show's development, but right now I just feel let down. I'm with you, @outrageousfrenchguy, Jaime's redemption is one of my favorite parts in the books, but that bit feels ruined now in the show - argh!

Yeah, the more I think about this episode the more I dislike it. I am frankly astounded to see Todd give it an A-. And I've seen such good reviews of this episode everywhere. I am mystified.

Seriously, the portrayal of Jaime raping Cersei is so, so awful. songstarliner I am getting the impression that this wasn't so much in any script that GRRM saw, but was much more a directorial/actor/editing choice. Because the director seems to believe that the scene ended up consensual when that is just clearly not the case.

But, blech!  Why would they even make this an implication? Yeah, Cersei is uncomfortable at the beginning of the scene in the book. It is because they are in the sept, people could see them and their son's corpse is there. She wants to have sex with him! If they had filmed THAT scene, I could understand the explanation of "Well, he was pressing her at the beginning but then it turned consensual".  But this portrayal was rape. WHY??  What in God's name was the point of this? It completely destroys Jaime's character arc. And what are they trying to say about Cersei? It just doesn't make a lick of sense.  It almost feels like they thought a scene of them having sex next to Joffrey's corpse wasn't shocking enough, so they did this just for the shock value. There is a lot about this which makes me very uncomfortable with the show, quite honestly.

Anyway, I really want to discuss how much I dislike this episode with people who know what I am talking about. And with Disqus at TOC it is just too hard. So, thanks for indulging me.

In one of the earlier Expert Review threads over there I mentioned that I felt like the show was underplaying Littlefinger in the story. And someone told me I was wrong. But, here we have Littlefinger essentially confessing to the crime and showing Sansa how it was done, and newbies still don't think he was the mastermind. I can't imagine we are going to get any further clarification from the show. What do you guys think?  Can you see the show outright spelling this out for people after this episode and the last already gave them everything they need?

And people still don't see Littlefinger being the mastermind?  They think he is following whose orders?  Now, granted, I know where the story is going and I know how freaking dangerous Littlefinger is.  But, it is incredible to me that HBO can air a scene of him standing there telling Varys "I want to create chaos so that I can then ascend the ladder of power" and yet I've actually heard newbies saying they don't think he was involved with this.  Like, people are saying they can't imagine why Littlefinger would want to frame Tyrion.  So, I am now forced to blame the show for sloppy storytelling.  I now really want these Eyrie scenes to start so I can finally start talking to my newbie friends about how much I fucking hate Littlefinger.

Also, remember how with the S3 finale we were all surprised to hear Stannis say he was going to sail to the Wall? And how it seemed like they brought Jon Snow back to the Wall too early?  As it turns out, all that stuff really did happen too early! Surprise!  So, now we are stalling for time with all the Night's Watch stuff. Sam has to protect Gilly, Jon's going back to Crasters.... blah blah blah.  I now dread seeing this story with all its stalled out scenes until episode 9.

And WTF are they doing with Stannis? So, he, Davos and Melisandre are just dithering about Dragonstone now? Is the show saying he doesn't have enough money/men to sail to the Wall now? So, they're going to ask the Iron Bank for money to pay for a sellsword army?  NOW? I can't help feeling like this is all a stall tactic in the story. (Though it would be cool to actually see the Iron Bank.)

And even the Arya/Hound scene felt pointless. This is the ultimate in stalled out stories. They're just going to wander around war-torn Westeros all season? Across lands controlled by the Lannisters?

And I know I am letting book bias influence this, but I am already bored with Dany's story.

Basically, I thought Charles Dance saved this episode. His two scenes were the only scenes I really liked.

Episode 3 was really weird. There were like four scenes in the entire episode that actually correlated to anything that had happened in the book and of those, half of them needed disclaimers ("Jaime and Cersi Doing it in the Sept: Now With 100% More Rape!" "Dany vs. The Champion of Mereen: Now With 100% Less Strong Belwas Diarrhea Dumps!).  The lack of Strong Belwas I guess I can deal with, but Jaime being a rapist basically undoes a lot of character development that happens in the show (to say nothing of the book) and will make Jaime's later realization that his sister is horrible and his dedication to being a good Kingsguard later seem more forced I think.

In addition some of the made for TV stuff in it felt really off-model this week too...the orcs Thenn's raid on that random village, kind of bugged me for some reason.  I don't remember them being all that important in the books at all.  They were kind of just mentioned in passing ("Mance even has hornfeet and Thenns too!"), but now they're supposed to be the big bad of season four or something.

I did like the Davos and Shireen scene, mainly because Davos is awesome, but also because it didn't fundamentally change either of those two characters.