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Post by nowimnothing on Mar 12, 2015 18:19:25 GMT -5
It seems a little upmarket for Cat of the Canals, but maybe it'll feel different in action. Could be one of her disguises, but that might put her in Winds of Winter territory if you have read her sample chapter.
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Post by Douay-Rheims-Challoner on Mar 12, 2015 18:40:07 GMT -5
I'm waiting to read Wind of Winter when I can actually read the whole damn book, so basically never.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Mar 14, 2015 1:19:58 GMT -5
I just want GRRM to tell me definitively that Stannis hasn't been killed by Ramsay Bolton. Because that would be completely nauseating. And I know these books aren't really fair, but.... come on. I passionately hate Ramsay. And sending Stannis and Theon on a beeline for him is such a cruel tease. And the sample chapter released on this was just an even bigger tease.
I have patience to find out what happens with Bran, Arya, Sansa, Dany, Tyrion, hell, even Jon. But this Stannis/Ramsay confrontation has the possibility to be either awesome or one of the worst things in the entire series.
Edited to add: Anyway, I'm pretty excited for the new season. I'm excited to get some movement on Arya's storyline finally. Have no idea what the show has planned for Sansa, so that is exciting. Looking forward to seeing what they do with Tyrion. Hoping for an improvement over the books, there. Also looking forward to Cersei's story. And I'm interested in how Dorne will be presented.
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Post by Lady Bones on Mar 14, 2015 13:20:31 GMT -5
I just want GRRM to tell me definitively that Stannis hasn't been killed by Ramsay Bolton. Because that would be completely nauseating. And I know these books aren't really fair, but.... come on. I passionately hate Ramsay. And sending Stannis and Theon on a beeline for him is such a cruel tease. And the sample chapter released on this was just an even bigger tease. I have patience to find out what happens with Bran, Arya, Sansa, Dany, Tyrion, hell, even Jon. But this Stannis/Ramsay confrontation has the possibility to be either awesome or one of the worst things in the entire series. Edited to add: Anyway, I'm pretty excited for the new season. I'm excited to get some movement on Arya's storyline finally. Have no idea what the show has planned for Sansa, so that is exciting. Looking forward to seeing what they do with Tyrion. Hoping for an improvement over the books, there. Also looking forward to Cersei's story. And I'm interested in how Dorne will be presented. I'd say that the suspicion that Ramsay was just lying is fairly likely. I subscribe to it, and that's not out of denial or particular love for Stannis. He's only grown on me because he improved as a candidate for ruler as time went on, and as there have been fewer and fewer candidates. It just seems more likely with the series tending not to have big moments like that off-page/screen*, especially given that a POV character, Theon, would've been present. It seems most comparable to when we were told in Clash of Kings that Bran and Rickon had been executed. Anyway, what I'm worried about is Stannis possibly wanting to execute Theon at some point. Theon needs his full redemptive arc, damn it! *The only one I can think of off-hand is Balon's assassination, and that was needed to intentionally leave it ambiguous/there's no real way to justify a POV character being present for that. As for Ramsay's demise, which seems likely to happen in TWOW, it'll either be Theon or Roose just getting sick of his own son as a liability and finally taking him out, either of which would be satisfying.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Mar 15, 2015 1:36:02 GMT -5
I'd say that the suspicion that Ramsay was just lying is fairly likely. I subscribe to it, and that's not out of denial or particular love for Stannis. He's only grown on me because he improved as a candidate for ruler as time went on, and as there have been fewer and fewer candidates. It just seems more likely with the series tending not to have big moments like that off-page/screen*, especially given that a POV character, Theon, would've been present. It seems most comparable to when we were told in Clash of Kings that Bran and Rickon had been executed. Anyway, what I'm worried about is Stannis possibly wanting to execute Theon at some point. Theon needs his full redemptive arc, damn it! *The only one I can think of off-hand is Balon's assassination, and that was needed to intentionally leave it ambiguous/there's no real way to justify a POV character being present for that. As for Ramsay's demise, which seems likely to happen in TWOW, it'll either be Theon or Roose just getting sick of his own son as a liability and finally taking him out, either of which would be satisfying. I'm ambivalent about the idea of Stannis as the King, but I do really like him as a character. I think he is so fun to follow. I thought he was a great character from the opening of book 2, and I've only liked him more and more as the series has gone on. It would be awful for me if he were killed by fucking Ramsay Bolton. Like, seriously depressing. Ramsay Bolton? Are you kidding me, GRRM? See, I don't have any particular need to see Stannis become King. But, what I *do* want to see is Stannis liberate the North, taking out Ramsay and possibly Roose, too. This idea is too tantalizing. Stannis, a character who is known to burn traitors alive, heading straight for the Boltons? What I really want is for GRRM to let him march all the way to the Riverlands and sack The Twins. If ever I wanted to see characters sacrificed to the Lord of Light, Wader Frey and Ramsay Bolton would be my top 2 choices. If I could get that, I wouldn't really care what happened to Stannis afterwards. This would be enough for me. I just really, really, really want to see Ramsay, Roose and Walder Frey pay for their crimes. And right now I don't see any other character in Westeros who could take care of this. (And I don't want to wait for Dany to get there.) Stannis is, in fact, ideally suited to do this. And it would be one of my biggest disappointments in the series if GRRM turned this into another "hey, these books aren't fair" lesson and had him killed by that psychopath Ramsay. I don't think Stannis would execute Theon. At least, not book Stannis. I don't think so... It would be so amazing if Theon actually killed Ramsay. There has to be *some* reason GRRM has kept Theon alive, right? I think this part of the story is so tantalizing for me because it feels more concrete than a lot of the rest of it. Like, it feels like there is genuine momentum and a clear trajectory there. Arya, Bran and Sansa all have stories that feel a bit more amorphous. I'm not entire sure what GRRM is doing with Jon, but I find it hard to believe he'd just be dead at this point. I think he's only mostly dead! Which means, slightly alive! The Essos stuff is kind of interesting, in that we might finally bring some characters to Dany who can help her. Hey, maybe she'll finally get off that continent in this book! Maybe? And the Tyrion material in WoW is bound to be better than what he had in the last book. But all that stuff feels like material that won't pay off until the end. The Stannis/Theon vs. the Boltons story seems like something that could be resolved in book 6. So, that is the story I am most anxious to get.
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Post by Baramos on Mar 15, 2015 2:25:00 GMT -5
As far as blowing through AFFC and ADWD, the final episode will supposedly feature the Arya chapter previewed by Martin for Winds of Winter, with Arya assassinating Meryn Trant instead of Raff the Sweetling as a scene in episode 10.
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Post by nowimnothing on Mar 17, 2015 7:43:04 GMT -5
As far as blowing through AFFC and ADWD, the final episode will supposedly feature the Arya chapter previewed by Martin for Winds of Winter, with Arya assassinating Meryn Trant instead of Raff the Sweetling as a scene in episode 10. While I am sad that her time as Cat will only last one season (which in GOT could be only a few episodes featuring her) that chapter was fucking great and I cannot wait to see it.
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Post by nowimnothing on Mar 17, 2015 13:08:00 GMT -5
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Post by Desert Dweller on Mar 19, 2015 23:12:44 GMT -5
As far as blowing through AFFC and ADWD, the final episode will supposedly feature the Arya chapter previewed by Martin for Winds of Winter, with Arya assassinating Meryn Trant instead of Raff the Sweetling as a scene in episode 10. This sounds great! I am all for Arya killing Meryn Trant. He's definitely in my top 10 of "GoT characters I most want to see die." As far as other changes go.... The thing I am most upset about is still the cut of Arianne. I don't like what that does to the entire culture of Dorne. Though, I am curious to see how Dorne will be portrayed. Cutting Arianne and (most likely) Aegon makes me wonder what the point of having Dorne in the story is. I also am very curious to see how Doran Martell is going to be portrayed. I was very encouraged when they cast Alexander Siddig. Hope Doran turns out to be an interesting character. The story I am actually now most intrigued by in Season 5 will be Sansa's. That story went way off the map in S4. I, like others, wonder if the show will be replacing Lady Stoneheart's quest for revenge with this Sansa/Littlefinger story. This would take on an even more uneasy feel since a lot of the people Lady Stoneheart targeted would actually be of political benefit for Littlefinger to take out. And I am so happy to hear we are going to skip over most (all?) of Tyrion's wandering in ADWD. While simultaneously cutting down a lot of Dany's story. I do still really like the books, but there is something to be said for the pacing of the tv series.
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Post by sarapen on Mar 24, 2015 15:04:22 GMT -5
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Post by Desert Dweller on Mar 24, 2015 23:35:06 GMT -5
I like that two of them answered "No one".
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heroboy
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Post by heroboy on Mar 25, 2015 17:33:36 GMT -5
Maybe it's tongue-in-cheek, but Davos and Jon Snow don't really understand their characters. Maybe Jon doesn't want the throne, but all he's ever wanted in life was to be Robb Stark. The only reason why he didn't take Winterfell was his sense of duty, as dearly as he wanted it. As for Davos, I think he would probably kill himself before taking that kind of responsibility. All he wants is to serve Stannis, and get back to his wife in mostly one piece. Roose and Mace know their characters pretty well, though.
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Post by nowimnothing on Mar 26, 2015 5:27:57 GMT -5
Maybe it's tongue-in-cheek, but Davos and Jon Snow don't really understand their characters. Maybe Jon doesn't want the throne, but all he's ever wanted in life was to be Robb Stark. The only reason why he didn't take Winterfell was his sense of duty, as dearly as he wanted it. As for Davos, I think he would probably kill himself before taking that kind of responsibility. All he wants is to serve Stannis, and get back to his wife in mostly one piece. Roose and Mace know their characters pretty well, though. I think there is a difference between wanting to be accepted by his family and wanting to rule. Jon did not necessarily want to lead the watch either. He is a lot like Ned in that way. As for Davos, I agree, but if it was the actor talking about who they would like to see rather than what the character might want, you could do worse than Davos. He might not have the political mind for it, but he is tough and fair.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2015 14:39:16 GMT -5
Well, the day has finally come when we'll have to mark SPOILERS in the experts thread. Is anyone NOT reading spoilers for the new season? Just in case ..... SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS Is Sansa really going to Winterfell to marry Ramsey Bolton? Is that a thing that's happening or is it speculation? I can't remember where I read that.
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Post by rimjobflashmob on Apr 12, 2015 18:22:03 GMT -5
Well, the day has finally come when we'll have to mark SPOILERS in the experts thread. Is anyone NOT reading spoilers for the new season? Just in case ..... SPOILERS SPOILERS SPOILERS Is Sansa really going to Winterfell to marry Ramsey Bolton? Is that a thing that's happening or is it speculation? I can't remember where I read that.[/spoiler{
SPOILERS CONTINUE Is it because of the promotional images of her in the Winterfell crypts? That would probably be a kickass plot line but I don't know if LF would risk his pervy obsession with her just to snag the North, he seems pretty cozy in the Vale for now.
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Post by Douay-Rheims-Challoner on Apr 12, 2015 18:47:20 GMT -5
songstarliner rimjobflashmobYou do know we have a spoiler code right? Like so: [spoiler][/spoiler] And in action: Turns out Rickon is Tyrion's dad! Time travel is involved. Anyway Sky Atlantic has caved and will simulcast most of the season this year same time as the US. I say most because the premiere itself is exempt.
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Post by Tea Rex on Apr 12, 2015 19:53:18 GMT -5
songstarliner rimjobflashmobYou do know we have a spoiler code right? Like so: [spoiler][/spoiler] And in action: Turns out Rickon is Tyrion's dad! Time travel is involved. Anyway Sky Atlantic has caved and will simulcast most of the season this year same time as the US. I say most because the premiere itself is exempt. Why...why was I tagged in this? I don't know what's going on! I'm not an expert!!
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2015 19:54:17 GMT -5
songstarliner rimjobflashmobYou do know we have a spoiler code right? Like so: [spoiler][/spoiler] And in action: Turns out Rickon is Tyrion's dad! Time travel is involved. Anyway Sky Atlantic has caved and will simulcast most of the season this year same time as the US. I say most because the premiere itself is exempt. I do! Sorry, I was on my phone and didn't think to enter code manually because I am a dummy. Anyway ..... So yes, I think that idea is fan speculation based on a millisecond clip in the trailer, and not a true spoiler. On the one hand, I think LF might trade Sansa to the Boltons (essentially making Roose Bolton Warden of the North) in exchange for their support against the Lords of the Vale, but yeah on the other hand, does he really want to give up Catelyn Tully's eldest and most beautiful daughter? Thing is I think book Baelish has a Long Game in mind that may end with him or his puppet on the Iron Throne, but show Baelish seems a bit more sentimental and stupid. Well anyway, I'm actually excited about new material this season. Woooooooot! Six minutes!
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Post by Desert Dweller on Apr 12, 2015 21:18:36 GMT -5
Just saw the new episode. I'm still thinking about it. (Side note: HBO Now worked perfectly.) Very interesting that the flashback didn't give the other part of that prophecy Cersei heard. I'm quite excited at how the show sent Varys with Tyrion. This is looking to be an immediate upgrade to Tyrion's book plot. I'm still kind of liking Hizdahr, and that is still slightly worrying. LOL'd at Lancel saying he'd pray for Tywin's soul. Probably laughed almost as hard as Cersei. Still not sure how I feel about the story at the Wall. These characters (Jon and Stannis) are just not nearly as interesting on screen as they are in the books. Also enjoying Sweet Robin getting his ass kicked. But, yeah, I am slightly alarmed at Littlefinger saying they were going west. Isn't "west" Winterfell? There is no way I want to see Sansa headed there. The best case scenario for Winterfell right now is that it is sacked by Stannis, who likely wouldn't even know she was there. Worst case is the speculation that Littlefinger would try to marry her to Ramsay Bolton. Good grief. I think I'd rather be burned alive by Melisandre.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2015 21:29:46 GMT -5
West has to mean Winterfell. They'll cut out all the Jeyne Poole/Fake Arya bit and put Sansa in her place - yeah? Poor thing. I mean they can't go as far as the books, right?? Fucking Ramsey - what is Petyr thinking? He's a shit for sure, but this is a bit much. I don't buy for a second that he doesn't know exactly how insane Ramsey is. Maybe he has some kind of sneaky plan. Argh, goodnight I am rambling!
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Post by Desert Dweller on Apr 12, 2015 23:34:40 GMT -5
I really hope this Littlefinger/Sansa bit is just a fakeout by the show. They wouldn't really do this, yeah?
What do we all think the show is going to do with Brienne and Pod this season? I really have no idea.
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Post by nowimnothing on Apr 13, 2015 7:39:18 GMT -5
Without Jeyne Poole, I do think Sansa will have to fill that role in a way. If that is so then Brienne's logical path would be to Winterfell as well. Maybe she runs into the Stoneheartless? brotherhood and co-opts them into her quest. That would turn Winterfell into a real focal point. Stannis from the North, Brienne and the Brotherhood from the West, Ramsey, Theon, Petyr and Sansa all scheming on the inside.
That would be a big change from the books but it makes sense in terms of efficiency and fits with some of the other changes they have made.
Cersie and Arya's storylines look to be playing out pretty much as written. Tyrion gets a welcome acceleration of his trip which is good for both his and Dany's plot pacing.
Using Jaime as our introduction to Dorne should work out as well.
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heroboy
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Post by heroboy on Apr 13, 2015 9:47:45 GMT -5
I don't understand how West could mean Winterfell, though, as the Eyrie is as far south as Riverrun. And even if they meant they had to go west then head north, going through the Crossroads and up the Neck would be impossible, since either the loyal Northmen or the Ironborn hold Moat Cailin. If he wanted to make an alliance with the Boltons, it would be easier to head east then sail to the Dreadfort, though I may be thinking too much about this and attributing too much information from the books.
West could also mean making an alliance at The Twins, have Sansa make a claim for Riverrun, or for LF to take his seat at Harrenhal.
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Apr 13, 2015 9:53:28 GMT -5
Without Jeyne Poole, I do think Sansa will have to fill that role in a way. If that is so then Brienne's logical path would be to Winterfell as well. Maybe she runs into the Stoneheartless? brotherhood and co-opts them into her quest. That would turn Winterfell into a real focal point. Stannis from the North, Brienne and the Brotherhood from the West, Ramsey, Theon, Petyr and Sansa all scheming on the inside. That would be a big change from the books but it makes sense in terms of efficiency and fits with some of the other changes they have made. Cersie and Arya's storylines look to be playing out pretty much as written. Tyrion gets a welcome acceleration of his trip which is good for both his and Dany's plot pacing. Using Jaime as our introduction to Dorne should work out as well. Agreed on all this. I like all the changes* so far, and think they'll make the plot more efficient. Also if they get Theon involved with Sansa's plot it could have some interesting resonance. I'm really interested to see where they go with it. *Except for giving me less Ciaran Hinds on my TV screen.
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Post by nowimnothing on Apr 13, 2015 10:14:12 GMT -5
Without Jeyne Poole, I do think Sansa will have to fill that role in a way. If that is so then Brienne's logical path would be to Winterfell as well. Maybe she runs into the Stoneheartless? brotherhood and co-opts them into her quest. That would turn Winterfell into a real focal point. Stannis from the North, Brienne and the Brotherhood from the West, Ramsey, Theon, Petyr and Sansa all scheming on the inside. That would be a big change from the books but it makes sense in terms of efficiency and fits with some of the other changes they have made. Cersie and Arya's storylines look to be playing out pretty much as written. Tyrion gets a welcome acceleration of his trip which is good for both his and Dany's plot pacing. Using Jaime as our introduction to Dorne should work out as well. Agreed on all this. I like all the changes* so far, and think they'll make the plot more efficient. Also if they get Theon involved with Sansa's plot it could have some interesting resonance. I'm really interested to see where they go with it. *Except for giving me less Ciaran Hinds on my TV screen. Hey, didn't you say over at the old country that you were one of the ne'er-do-wells that downloaded the first 4 episodes? You probably know if I am right or not already! Damn! I am so tempted! But I think I can hold out. If they were in HD I don't think I could.
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Apr 13, 2015 10:23:47 GMT -5
Agreed on all this. I like all the changes* so far, and think they'll make the plot more efficient. Also if they get Theon involved with Sansa's plot it could have some interesting resonance. I'm really interested to see where they go with it. *Except for giving me less Ciaran Hinds on my TV screen. Hey, didn't you say over at the old country that you were one of the ne'er-do-wells that downloaded the first 4 episodes? You probably know if I am right or not already! Damn! I am so tempted! But I think I can hold out. If they were in HD I don't think I could. I am indeed, they went up on Couchtuner so I watched it there. Like I said on the Old Country, I'm always stuck watching it on my iPad anyway, so watching it on my computer wasn't all that different quality-wise.
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Post by nowimnothing on Apr 13, 2015 10:30:35 GMT -5
I don't understand how West could mean Winterfell, though, as the Eyrie is as far south as Riverrun. And even if they meant they had to go west then head north, going through the Crossroads and up the Neck would be impossible, since either the loyal Northmen or the Ironborn hold Moat Cailin. If he wanted to make an alliance with the Boltons, it would be easier to head east then sail to the Dreadfort, though I may be thinking too much about this and attributing too much information from the books. West could also mean making an alliance at The Twins, have Sansa make a claim for Riverrun, or for LF to take his seat at Harrenhal. I had not looked back at the map until you mentioned it but yes. Plus they were dropping Robin off at House Royce which is South of The Eyrie so West would be Harrenhal or even Riverrun. But neither of those places really fit as places beyond Cersei's reach. I think only Winterfell could offer that. I am having trouble with Petyr's long game here though.
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Post by disqusf3dme on Apr 13, 2015 18:20:10 GMT -5
A saw a YouTube comment calling this "the fanfic season" and I have to say, they're pretty spot on. Some of the changes are so wildly different this season. I kind of like the changes though, the books will always exist as their own entity, and since the show is deviating so wildly from the source material now, it's fun to view it as a "what if" kinda deal. Leaked episode spoilers, because I'm a bad person: Jaime going to Dorne with Bronn is like, pure fan service. Did anyone else got some kind of 80s/90s action movie vibe from it? Bronn is ready to retire, live a life of leisure, but then Jaime shows up with his fucking beautiful hair and what I swear to God is like a medieval version of a leather jacket, and he basically gives Bronn the Westeros version of a "one last mission" speech. I just really want the next time they appear to be in a cold open, like Jaime is being tortured and one of the guards walks in and kills the torturer and pulls off his helmet to reveal Bronn. Wacky misadventures ensues. That would be a great spin-off. Westeros Vice. Or True Detective Season 3.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Apr 15, 2015 2:58:19 GMT -5
I am having trouble with Petyr's long game here though. This is a huge question for me. Assuming they go to Winterfell, why would Littlefinger do that? Spoilers for leaked episodes and a lot of other thoughts: The changes in this Littlefinger/Sansa storyline are both exciting and strange. It is really cool to throw Sansa into that storyline, now making it a huge focal point for the story. However.... my above point still remains. The best case scenario for Sansa there is what Littlefinger describes on screen: Stannis sacks Winterfell and gets rid of the Boltons. Given that the show has now actually left Sansa there, are we to assume that this is going to be what happens? If so, is that a Book spoiler since GRRM has apparently told D&D what is going to happen? Or are D&D just making up what they think will be the better story? Or,.... is Theon going to break her out, and then the two of them will travel north and meet up with Stannis, thereby bringing the story back in line with what is going on in the book, thereby leaving the fate of Stannis, Ramsay and Winterfell still up in the air?
I mean, I must assume Sansa is not going to be killed by the Boltons. So, either Stannis gets to her, or she gets to Stannis, right?
And what is really baffling to me is WHY Littlefinger would do this. Okay, so they're going to handwave the Ramsay thing by claiming that Littlefinger doesn't know anything about him. I don't buy that, but whatever. Littlefinger doesn't seem to be lying when he tells Sansa that he wants her there so that when Stannis gets there he'll name Sansa Wardeness of the North. Okay, that sounds logical. But..... why would Littlefinger want this? Why would Littlefinger at all do absolutely anything to make Stannis Baratheon's case stronger? Because that is what this plan will do. Stannis marches in, liberates Winterfell, executes the Boltons as traitors and returns control of the North to the Stark family. I gotta figure that makes Stannis a very popular guy in the North. It seems like that wouldn't really benefit Littlefinger. Kinda the opposite, I assume, yeah?
Keeping on with somewhat questionable character motivations.... what does Jaime think he is doing? Every time he says, "We're not trying to start a war" I want to ask him, "What do you think is going to happen if you abduct Myrcella from Prince Doran Martell's court, thereby invalidating what is basically the only agreement which is preventing Dorne from seceding from the Iron Throne?" I mean, not that this really matters, since there is no way Dorne is coming down on the side of the Lannisters in the end. But still. It makes Jaime sound really naive and delusional to keep saying that. I kept wanting Bronn to ask him about this, rather than just shoot him skeptical glances.
Whilst, in general, these 4 episodes basically make mincemeat out of Books 4 and 5, the ending of Episode 4 is going to absolutely enrage any book purists who are still watching the show. I'm reasonably sure that by the end of Season 5 of the show, any newbie would find Books 4 and 5 nearly unrecognizable.
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Post by Nudeviking on Apr 15, 2015 3:03:19 GMT -5
I really hope this Littlefinger/Sansa bit is just a fakeout by the show. They wouldn't really do this, yeah? What do we all think the show is going to do with Brienne and Pod this season? I really have no idea. Pod and Brienne are going to get married and purchase that inn that Hot Pie is working in. Their scenes will be akin to a farcical workplace sitcom.
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