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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Feb 9, 2015 1:15:26 GMT -5
Better Call Saul is a new television drama on this one cable channel, AMC, a spinoff of another AMC show called Breaking Bad, which achieved some popularity when it aired back in the late '00s and early '10s. It stars an actor/comedian named Bob Odenkirk, who plays the titular Saul Goodman, a lawyer who eschews ethics to make more money.
I thought the pilot was pretty good. That opening sequence was pretty fantastic, that first image reminiscent of so many cook scenes from the parent program, effectively juxtaposing how Saul has been drastically cut down from the wealthy and ostentatious legal counsel to BrBa's meth cooks to a disheveled middle-aged guy working at a Cinnabon. And that clip of Saul sitting in front of the TV watching his old "Better Call Saul" commercials is only marginally less pathetic than Walter White offering That Vacuum Cleaner Guy $10,000 to stay with him and play cards for an hour on "Granite State" (but not as pathetic as the fact that Saul started watching QVC, nothing is as pathetic as watching fucking QVC). And he journey of how the kinda hapless Jimmy McGill became the Saul Goodman that we all know should be pretty exciting. Because Jimmy definitely is not very good at being a lawyer. That defense of those fucking college kids was a painfully tonally inappropriate use of Jimmy/Saul's trademarked Flippant Lawyer-Speak, given that they, you know, decapitated a corpse's head and had sex with it, and he's frequently rehearsing what he's going to say to jury members/prospective clients, something the hyper-confident Saul never had to do. Also, his failure to pick up on the fact that it's super suspicious that a woman as rich as County Treasurer Guy's wife would be driving an '88 station wagon was like sub-Walter-White-level-sloppy criminal scheme. Speaking of which, that final scene was impressively suspenseful. And the entire episode was as beautifully and creatively shot as BrBa was, so there's also that.
On the other hand, there was definitely a bit of awkward this-is-the-situation-in-which-our-protagonist-finds-himself-at-the-outset-of-the-series exposition stuff, which feels a bit more noticeable than it felt in BrBa's pilot. Also, given that Jonathan Banks is going to be one of the main cast members of this show or whatevs, was it really necessary to awkwardly force him into a cameo role in this episode just so people could go "Hey, there's Mike!"? Because I thought it was implied on BrBa that he wnet into being a PI/enforcer-type shortly after leaving/being-fired-from/whatever-it-was the police force, so is his parking ticket guy gig meant to give him a low-profile, or lazy writing or what? And as cool as the return of Tuco is, it's going to strain credibility, and make it impossible for this show to even take a tiny step out of BrBa's shadow if every episode turns into Guest Star Character From BrBa Of The Week. So hopefully those awkward cameos were mostly just to try and draw in viewers and aren't going to be a regular thing. Or if they do make unlikely cameos a regular thing, just be gratuitously obvious and unsubtle about it and have Walt walk into every room on some half-baked pretense at the end of every single scene right after it's been vacated by Saul, Mike et. al., with a logo-censorship-type label hovering over his shirt which reads "Breaking Bad's Bryan Cranston reprising his role as Walter White", and a subtitle which reads "Isn't this quite ironic?"
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Post by Lone Locust of the Apocalypse on Feb 9, 2015 7:40:16 GMT -5
I almost had a heart attack when Tuco showed up. A bit nervous about what they're going to do with him.
Didn't he see Betsy get in the car? I think the skaters are the ones who fucked up.
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Post by Lone Locust of the Apocalypse on Feb 9, 2015 10:46:48 GMT -5
Skater bros - dead or alive?
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Post by ganews on Feb 9, 2015 11:43:58 GMT -5
Skater bros - dead or alive? Dead, I kinda hope? As I said at TOC, my favorite shot was the dented trashcan we see before Jimmy takes the elevator up in the law firm. |
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Feb 9, 2015 13:25:07 GMT -5
This was so great, and I'm so glad to be watching more of Vince Gilligans excellent writing. Can't wait to see what they do next!
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2015 15:17:40 GMT -5
I was fine with the Mike appearance, he does end up working with Saul, and he is going to be one of the main cast members, so it makes sense that they would run into each other somewhere they are bound to meet each other again.
The Tuco one I'm not so crazy about, Tuco was one of my least favorite BrBa antagonists, and it also feels weirdly contrived this is how he ends up meeting him, in such a small scheme. As for future cameos, I will dread the day Walt makes a cameo, unless it is in the background and they don't a zoom in or anything or try to shove it in there. Jessie I'm fine with, because he did know Saul before BrBa took place, right? Sorry, my memory is a little hazy and I haven't seen season 2 since like 4 or 5 years ago.
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Post-Lupin
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Post by Post-Lupin on Feb 9, 2015 16:20:19 GMT -5
I'm loving how OP felt the need to explain what Breaking Bad is, round here.
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Post by Lone Locust of the Apocalypse on Feb 9, 2015 16:26:19 GMT -5
I'm loving how OP felt the need to explain what Breaking Bad is, round here. In 2020, some guy on Twitter is going to be ecstatic when he finds out there's a spin-off of Better Call Saul called Breaking Bad. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2015 17:00:31 GMT -5
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Post by Lady Bones on Feb 9, 2015 17:08:38 GMT -5
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Post by Powerthirteen on Feb 9, 2015 17:44:30 GMT -5
I was worried that I might have to resort to unsavory methods to watch this, but lucky for me Amazon is streaming the pilot for free! Of course that only whet my appetite for the next episode, which I imagine will not be, but at least I can feel honest this week. I really enjoyed the pilot, although I do wonder whether we'll ever get back to Cinnabon Saul -- that plot thread is currently so fucking sad that if we never get anymore of the Saga of Jimmy McGill beyond his life as a mall manager I'll be pretty bummed out.
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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Feb 9, 2015 19:09:05 GMT -5
I almost had a heart attack when Tuco showed up. A bit nervous about what they're going to do with him. Didn't he see Betsy get in the car? I think the skaters are the ones who fucked up. Yep; just checked my DVD recording. At first I assumed that Tuco's grandmother was Bets's housekeeper, and that it was just sloppy planning on Saul's part, failing to thoroughly vet that Betsy was the vehicle's owner, and assuming someone as apparently well off as Betsy would own a 16 year old station wagon. And honestly, the fact that this apparently isn't the case just utterly stretches the boundaries of the realistic WAY too far. That Tuco's grandmother owned the same make and model '88 station wagon (both with a licensce plate that begins with the number 4), as the treasurer's wife that Saul, the future lawyer of Walt, the guy who would eventually be responsible for Tuco's downfall, was trying to swindle his way into being the lawyer for. And that both were driving it down the same street at the same exact time of day. Only, unlike wildly implausible airplane collisions, this absurd coincidence isn't grounded in the thematic resonance that BrBa's absurd coincidences were. So hopefully Gilligan et. al. have some compelling explanations up their sleeves. |
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Post by Lone Locust of the Apocalypse on Feb 9, 2015 19:13:38 GMT -5
I almost had a heart attack when Tuco showed up. A bit nervous about what they're going to do with him. Didn't he see Betsy get in the car? I think the skaters are the ones who fucked up. Yep; just checked my DVD recording. At first I assumed that Tuco's grandmother was Bets's housekeeper, and that it was just sloppy planning on Saul's part, failing to thoroughly vet that Betsy was the vehicle's owner, and assuming someone as apparently well off as Betsy would own a 16 year old station wagon. And honestly, the fact that this apparently isn't the case just utterly stretches the boundaries of the realistic WAY too far. That Tuco's grandmother owned the same make and model '88 station wagon (both with a licensce plate that begins with the number 4), as the treasurer's wife that Saul, the future lawyer of Walt, the guy who would eventually be responsible for Tuco's downfall, was trying to swindle his way into being the lawyer for. And that both were driving it down the same street at the same exact time of day. Only, unlike wildly implausible airplane collisions, this absurd coincidence isn't grounded in the thematic resonance that BrBa's absurd coincidences were. So hopefully Gilligan et. al. have some compelling explanations up their sleeves.  |
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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Feb 9, 2015 19:15:59 GMT -5
I was fine with the Mike appearance, he does end up working with Saul, and he is going to be one of the main cast members, so it makes sense that they would run into each other somewhere they are bound to meet each other again. The Tuco one I'm not so crazy about, Tuco was one of my least favorite BrBa antagonists, and it also feels weirdly contrived this is how he ends up meeting him, in such a small scheme. As for future cameos, I will dread the day Walt makes a cameo, unless it is in the background and they don't a zoom in or anything or try to shove it in there. Jessie I'm fine with, because he did know Saul before BrBa took place, right? Sorry, my memory is a little hazy and I haven't seen season 2 since like 4 or 5 years ago. Maybe the penultimate episode of the season will be like that one Gas Leak Year episode of Community where it was revealed that all the main characters unknowingly visited a yogurt shop in a mall at the same time a couple of years before they met, and the entire extended cast of BrBa will spend an entire episode randomly walking past one another and unwittingly interacting with one another at like a minor league baseball game or something. |
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Post by Roy Batty's Pet Dove on Feb 9, 2015 19:18:15 GMT -5
Yep; just checked my DVD recording. At first I assumed that Tuco's grandmother was Bets's housekeeper, and that it was just sloppy planning on Saul's part, failing to thoroughly vet that Betsy was the vehicle's owner, and assuming someone as apparently well off as Betsy would own a 16 year old station wagon. And honestly, the fact that this apparently isn't the case just utterly stretches the boundaries of the realistic WAY too far. That Tuco's grandmother owned the same make and model '88 station wagon (both with a licensce plate that begins with the number 4), as the treasurer's wife that Saul, the future lawyer of Walt, the guy who would eventually be responsible for Tuco's downfall, was trying to swindle his way into being the lawyer for. And that both were driving it down the same street at the same exact time of day. Only, unlike wildly implausible airplane collisions, this absurd coincidence isn't grounded in the thematic resonance that BrBa's absurd coincidences were. So hopefully Gilligan et. al. have some compelling explanations up their sleeves. But that's so insanely, insanely unlikely! |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 9, 2015 19:27:20 GMT -5
Everyone, this is in the same universe where you can build an automatic trunk gun and then be able to park that car exactly the way you want it and still be able to have it go off and magically kill EVERYONE in the room. So totally plausible!
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Post by Lone Locust of the Apocalypse on Feb 9, 2015 19:55:52 GMT -5
But that's so insanely, insanely unlikely! It's a coincidence, but not an unbelievable one. Coincidences happen in real life, just go with it. Correction, this is in the same universe where a genius with engineering knowledge can build an automatic trunk gun and position the car in front of a place he's already visited so that he can plausibly kill almost everyone in the room. Low-key? No, but entirely plausible within the reality the show constructed. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 10, 2015 1:12:39 GMT -5
Only so many times they can stretch reality before I give up! Like the magnets I can dig, because there was negative consequences for that huge clusterfuck of an operation. Gus walking out after the bomb was alright, because it was just for the cool imagery of a second and he died immediately afterward. While the trunk gun just seemed an easy way out of the mess. Though I do believe Gilligan has said they wrote themselves into a corner with that one, because the cold open for season 5 part 1, where Walt buys the machine gun was written before they had any idea of what they were going to really do with it. Or at least iirc that is what Gilligan did say in an interview with Alan Sepinwall once, I really don't feel like going back and trying to find it, but I do swear that is what I read!
I liked the second episode a lot, not as much as the pilot, but the pilot did have that present day cold open it could pull out of the bag of tricks. I felt the 2nd half of Mijo was really fantastic, that montage of Saul doing his job was as great as most other BrBa montages. The stuff with Tuco wasn't bad at all, but I still had a hard time getting into it, Tuco just isn't that interesting to me and neither was the stakes, part of this is stuff that most prequels will have problems with, Saul wasn't going to die. I knew he was going to survive in the desert and I didn't really care that much about if the twins were goners or not. Seeing Saul pull off his magic? Great! But not that much suspense in the end. Still a nice scene, but nothing special, and yes, I am kinda grading this on BrBa's scale, is it fair to hold it up to that level? Probably not. When they were in the house though, I did quite like that, maybe because Tuco mostly kept his mouth shut and was super intense instead of super fucking dumb.
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Post by LazBro on Feb 10, 2015 9:43:25 GMT -5
I'm loving the hell out of this so far. I have so many shows stacking up on the DVR that, let's be real, I'll never get to, but this one is appointment television and I will keep up. Quick thoughts:
1. The first half of "Mijo" was just perfection. Classic Breaking Bad. The decision to follow up the somewhat rambling, if compelling, debut with something this intense and focused was brilliant scheduling. If this first episode doesn't hook you, the second one will, and you only had to wait a day for it.
2. The commentariat over at The Old Country seems to have convinced themselves to deny a basic truth: cameos are fun! With a huckster like Jimmy in the lead, this show will never match the darkness of BB, so have a little fun with it. Don't abuse it, but would seeing Aaron Paul really "take you out of the story?" Not me.
3. Breadsticks, man. The length of that was a little indulgent. Especially following the long take on Jimmy's face in the desert.
4. Until he's Saul, he's Jimmy. (Or call him Saul, if you want. Basically I'm petitioning against using "Saul/Jimmy" all the time. We get it.)
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Post by Powerthirteen on Feb 10, 2015 16:14:26 GMT -5
Great second episode, but of all its many pleasures my favorite was the POV shot from inside the coffee machine that ended the montage. That was lovely.
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Post by Desert Dweller on Feb 10, 2015 23:28:27 GMT -5
I watched it at work today, streaming free on AMC's website! Thanks, AMC!
Okay, so yeah the twist with Tuco is a little ridiculous, but I'm going with it. BB was all about weird coincidences. I'm going with this one for a couple of reasons.
1. It was hilarious seeing Tuco just hanging out, cooking. Mmmmm, it made me crave some fajitas.
2. Tuco loves his abuelita. Of course. Tuco is all about respecting his elders.
3. I loved Raymond Cruz's performance in the desert scene. I thought he managed to be both scary and hilarious at the same time.
Plus, it was interesting to see Jimmy had a conscience at this point. I don't feel like I really need to see Tuco again, though. But, he was a great choice for how the script wanted to let Jimmy try to work his way out of a truly scary situation.
I'm liking how we knew so little about Saul that this show can almost do whatever it wants with him. However, I need an explanation for why Mike is a parking attendant ASAP.
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Post by Douay-Rheims-Challoner on Feb 11, 2015 18:08:53 GMT -5
I thought the coincidence was extremely thematically resonant. The Tuco plot is a classic one: Two-bit hustlers accidentally stumbling into a much more dangerous antagonist than they thought. It felt a bit like the kind of twist that's happen on Justified, oddly.
Generally really liked these episodes but I feel one weakness is Jimmy doesn't really have anyone to talk to - clearly his brother Chuck is partly meant to fill that point but only partly. Walt always had Jesse - or Saul - to expound his perspective at.
As far Aaron Paul goes? I'd bet money he will appear in the flashforward. They might wait until season two but it's gonna happen.
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Dellarigg
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Post by Dellarigg on Feb 11, 2015 19:05:19 GMT -5
Allow me to be Curtis Curmudgeon and say I'm finding it all slightly plodding and dull so far. Each scene seems at least a minute or two too long. I agree with the point made upthread - how much tension can there be if we know Saul survives? The only thing that can emotionally affect him is something happening to his brother, and any show that gets rid of Michael McKean ...
I'll keep watching, but I hope there's a jump up soon. Okay, Curmudgeon out.
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Post by ganews on Feb 11, 2015 23:38:26 GMT -5
how much tension can there be if we know Saul survives? I never understand this question. What difference does it make to know whether the title character lives or dies at the very end? Did anyone legitimately expect Walt to die in one of his various mid-season deadly situations? |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 12, 2015 0:02:12 GMT -5
how much tension can there be if we know Saul survives? I never understand this question. What difference does it make to know whether the title character lives or dies at the very end? Did anyone legitimately expect Walt to die in one of his various mid-season deadly situations? Not really, but at the same time there was the factor that we really didn't know. If a show is really masterful they could at least make us think Walt might be in trouble from getting caught or possibly dying. Since we don't know how the story ends for him, with Saul though? We do, there isn't even that 1 percent chance, and that will take some of the suspense out of it. That is a problem with most direct prequels, that fact will at least be in the back of people's heads. Even as a show as suspenseful as BrBa was, that did really make me think Walt got cornered where he couldn't be, BCS is going to have to fight a little bit more to make the suspense really hit deep. It wasn't voluntary when Saul met up with Tuco, just kind of a kneejerk reaction of my brain being like, "yo, calm down man, everything will be okay" and I instantly relaxed. |
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Post by MrsLangdonAlger on Feb 12, 2015 0:15:44 GMT -5
how much tension can there be if we know Saul survives? I never understand this question. What difference does it make to know whether the title character lives or dies at the very end? Did anyone legitimately expect Walt to die in one of his various mid-season deadly situations? I don't get it either. Almost no show is going to kill a main character in the middle of the run, so we ALWAYS know whether or not they're going to die. |
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Post by The Prighlofone on Feb 12, 2015 1:25:09 GMT -5
I've enjoyed the show a lot so far, even if I was hoping that there was more of a balance between comedy and drama, as Odenkirk/Gilligan/Gould/pretty much everyone has said it leans heavily towards the latter, and since Saul has a magnetic, humorous personality, I'd like to see more of it in the show where he's the protagonist, despite the obvious trouble he will likely get in.
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Dellarigg
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Post by Dellarigg on Feb 12, 2015 3:06:05 GMT -5
how much tension can there be if we know Saul survives? I never understand this question. What difference does it make to know whether the title character lives or dies at the very end? Did anyone legitimately expect Walt to die in one of his various mid-season deadly situations? I meant, for instance, the interminable scene with Tuco in the desert. It was played for tension, but there was none. Saul was pretty much exclusively a comic character previously, and I'd like to see things played more for laughs here. And the tension in BB came from wondering if Jesse, the immediate family or - God forbid - Hank was going to die, not Walt. |
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Post by Douay-Rheims-Challoner on Feb 12, 2015 3:44:02 GMT -5
Dellarigg All of those are supporting characters and very few of Better Call Saul's supporting characters are familiar. We had no idea what would happen to Saul's accomplices and the desert scene lingered more on their fate than his (in part to show Saul lawyer his way out of the situation; if Walt banked on his genius, Saul just throws whatever Hail Mary semi-legal defense thet sounds like it'd stick.)
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Dellarigg
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Post by Dellarigg on Feb 12, 2015 5:04:55 GMT -5
Dellarigg All of those are supporting characters and very few of Better Call Saul's supporting characters are familiar. We had no idea what would happen to Saul's accomplices and the desert scene lingered more on their fate than his (in part to show Saul lawyer his way out of the situation; if Walt banked on his genius, Saul just throws whatever Hail Mary semi-legal defense thet sounds like it'd stick.) Oh, I know - and I did say in my first, minimalist, post that maybe something would happen with Michael McKean (I'm pretty sure it will). I'm just saying that, 90 minutes in, the tilt from comedy to drama is making for a slightly leaden experience, for me. Hopefully they'll find a happy medium of comic menace along the way. If only Pinter was still around for a pass at the final draft. |
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